Knockoff's, Panasports and Greased Threads

[jmesh]

My car's prior owner put a set of panasports on the car and greased the threads holding the knockoff's on. He didn't drive the car at all and I've had a rear wheel come off once and start to come off a second time.

I'm going to remove the grease from the threads but how do I prevent this from happening in the future?

Is this a problem related to the Panasports or the grease or something else?

Thanks,

Jason

[iain.hamlton]

Jason,

Ouch!

I suggest:
you clean the threads
Then keep the wheels tight by tapping them until they stop moving (or torquing them) every time you drive.
once they remain tight, check them weekly.
It says something similar in the manual.

Do this procedure every time you have taken a wheel off.

Have the drive peg holes worn after the wheel came loose? It would happen with steel wheels, and you would be in market for new ones. Suggest you check there is no movement in the wheel when the nut is not quite tight. Also check the hub face for true and wear.

I had a steel wheel come loose, but fortunately it didn't come off.

I find I don't take wheels off unnecessaily now for fear of them coming loose as a result.

best regards, iain

[types26/36]

I've never had Panasports so couldn't say if they have a habit of coming loose but its always been a rule in the motor trade that you DO NOT grease wheel nuts/threads as this will lead to them coming loose, do as Iain suggests
and I dont think you will have a problem.

[Dave_Newcastle]

A possible tip? - as well as checking them with the hammer/spanner after a period, put a small piece of black tape on the wheel and a second adjacent to it on the spinner. You can then easily see if the spinner is moving at any opportunity and once you are confident it is not, easily remove the tape.

[MintSprint]

Previous owner had greased the threads on the standard (steel) knock-offs on my first Elan and they too, came loose.

Problem never recurred after cleaning off the grease, so hopefully you'll find that the problem is with the greas, not the wheels.

Only problem with alloys, particularly, is if they've worked loose a few times, the drive peg holes will be ovalised - as Ian says, it's a problem with steel wheels, never mind the much softer alloy... once that has happened, they will be very diffiuclt to keep tight and secure. Expensive advice, I know, but if they have suffered this sort of damage, you're better off throwing them away... it's simply too risky to continue using them!

[hatman]

I accept that you should never grease the threads but if wheel-loosening continues despite dry assembly would Loctite be the solution? Or is that a no-no too?

[MintSprint]

You really shouldn't need Loctite... if the wheels continue loosening themselves, you have an underlying problem that needs to be sorted.

I assume that you have checked that the hubs haven't been fitted on the wrong side of the car? Should be left hand threads on the left hand side, right hand threads on the right hand side.

[mac5777]

Hi Jason, I echo all that the others have said. I have Panasports and had steel wheels. One panasport came loose once but never came off. I checked for damage and they were OK. I now use 200 ft/lbs with a torque wrench (no grease) and never had any problems again. I do check the torque Periodically.
I was accustom to greasing my spitfire that had splines. Your P/O may have assumed the same. But never grease our Lotus spinners. If it came off and you have damaged the wheel, replace that wheel and keep them torqued. Don't even keep it as a spare.
What happened, did it come completely off the car? Was there any wheel arch damage? Hopefully you were in a parking lot and not on the track.

Sarto

[msd1107]

Jason,

Sarto is correct. Use a torque wrench. That way the wheel is torqued to the correct degree of tightness. Otherwise you may overtighten the nut which is just as bad as undertightening.

If you have federal nuts, you can get a socket the appropriate size for the torque wrench. If you have the older style eared spinners, there are leather lined pieces that can be used with the torque wrench. I believe Sarto makes those.

Of course, you could always convert back to bolt ons!

David
1968 36/7988

[jmesh]

Thanks for all the assistance. I'll definitely get out the brake cleaner and remove the grease. I'll also check the wheel and I guess I'll be buying a torque wrench and leather covered knockoff tightener.

The wheel did come off once. I wasn't driving it; the car was with a mechanic who was waking it out of its 10-year slumber. The wheel fell off and took a small bit of body with it, which was repaired and now ready for paint.

Actually, when the mechanic went to put the wheel back on the car, he noticed that there was only one peg in the hub and assumed that the wheel fell off because there weren't enough pegs.

Thanks again. I'll probably be back later today with more questions.

Jason

[mac5777]

Hi Jason, Glad no one was hurt. You may want to pick up a few more pegs just to be safe. Dave Bean had both styles of pegs. My elan also came with one peg missing. These you want to make sure that they are pressed or tapped in tight.

Dave Bean also may have a few of my knockoff spinner tools in stock. I have sold out and have started a new run which will be completed soon.
Ray at RDEnterpises may also have a few left.

There is a lot of West coast lotus people planning on the LOG27 this August in your backyard, Colorado.
Hope to meet you there.

Sarto

[steveww]

I have KO minilites fitter to my S4. I check the KO regularly to make sure they stay tight. Or you could do what I have seen many racers do; drill a small hole in one of the ears and loop some locking wire through to one of the spokes.

[jmesh]

I'd been thinking of drilling a hole and running safety wire through. I've seen that done at the track, too.

Below is a picture of the wheel and one of the hub. I removed the grease and knocked everything back on. I hope the damage to the inside of the wheel isn't too great. What do you think?

Also, there's one peg that's a different size from the others (I forgot to measure the diameter, though) and I assume it's the original.

I hope to make it to Log 27, but with a new kid on the way in June, it may be hard. We'll see. It would be nice to meet everybody.

Again, thanks for all of the assistance I've received this weekend.

Jason

[straightcut]

Jason,

You may want to read through this topic on the Kirkham Motorsports website (manufacturer of aluminum bodied Cobra replicas).

http://www.kirkhammotorsports.com/faq/t ... l#knockoff

Read through the section for jacking the car as it then goes into installing knockoffs with safety wire. Kirkham uses a much larger three eared aluminum knock off nut, so it's not quite the same as the Elan, but it is good background information. The idea of having one point of failure (knockoff) rather than four of five lug nuts has me feeling like drilling mine for safety wire as a quick way to eyeball it and tell instantly if it needs additional attention (before driving).

Mark

[cabc26b]

For what its worth -

Make sure the contact surfaces between the spiner and the wheel are clean. Cleanung the theads is less critical ant making sure these surfaces are clean. Also, if you are running equipment that is old(er) you might want to make sure that you are getting a complete seat along the surfaces.

Check the peg to wheel fit - you don't want bind otherwise final seating will occur when you start your drive, the spinner will be lose after a few turns.

Put them on carfuly, take a short spin, check and re hammer. use inspecters laquer if you want or need.

Wire - I use wire on the race car . but i can tell you they won't keep a improperly fixed the wheels on, they do give more time to stop , that is if you are paying attention -