Prop Balance

[KevJ+2]

I've just had my propshaft balanced at Bailey & Morris in St. Neots Cambs. It cost ?38 +vat which I think is really good value considering the peace of mind this gives!
Hope this helps anybody wondering about price.
www.baileymorris.co.uk

I have no connection to this company.

[AlfaLofa]

That sounds excellent value

As an aside it is always recommended that the prop and diff flanges be marked when removing the prop so that they can be reassembled as previously.

This is all very good - but what are you supposed to do if you are fitting a new prop or a new diff ?

[KevJ+2]

I suppose you would have to remove the diff flange and balance it with the prop?
But I suppose this would also mean setting up the diff with correct backlash, crush sleeve, oil seal etc etc.
Just had the diff repaired as well including all new bearings for ?300 so it's a tangerine pressy for 'er indoors this Xmas

[AlfaLofa]

I'm just about to send my diff off for a rebuild - all packed and ready to go.

I had previously become delusional and thought I might have a crack myself, hence.....

I have already purchased :

2 x Timken Side Carrier Bearings
2 x Timken Pinion Bearings
1 x Crush Spacer
1 x Pinion Oil Seal
1 x Pinion Nut/Washer

I got an ?85 rebuild price (using my parts) from Arrow Engineering - which sounds reasonable.
(http://www.arrowautoengineering.co.uk/).

There's another place a bit nearer to home I contacted but they wouldn't give a price until they had seen it.
(Vhttp://www.neilengineering.co.uk/)

By the time I have shipped a 20kg parcel to them it probably wouldn't be cost effective to decline their offer.

Trouble is where I live it's a day long round trip to anywhere - so shipping is my best option.

[KevJ+2]

Wow Steve, ?85 is a really good price and really good that they will use you parts.
I got a phone call to say they recommended all the bearings etc. to change with a ?300 bill
I asked about the firm beforehand but now think ?300 is a bit steep - I collect it on Thursday
Kev.

[William2]

Interesting, I just contacted Bailey Morris for a quote to rebalance my S4 propshaft and they said it would be ?59 + VAT!! Seems a big increase over ?38.

[rgh0]

Lets do a little dynamic analysis.
1. Assume you prop shaft was balanced in the first place - i.e. no unacceptable vibration was experienced before universal joint replacement
2. You have replaced the 2 universal joints. They are a very symmetrical precision component held symmetrically around the prop shaft axis by the yoke and circlips. Changing the univeral joints should not upset the prop shaft balance assuming the yokes holding them are not worn.
3. The prop shaft balance, even if tested on a balancing machine, should not have changed just with universal joint replacement. If it is out of balance when tested it was out of balance to begin with. But this does not appear to have been a problem refer to 1. above.
4. Alignment of the 2 Universal joints is not a problem in the Elan prop shaft as the universal joints are fixed on the shaft.
5. The only other possible cause of vibration would be eccentric mounting of the prop shaft. This would not be detected by balancing so balancing is a waste of time in this case At the front the shaft is held by a bearing and spline, if badly worn then could be eccentric, but no vibration, refer to 1. so unlikely. At the rear could be eccentric if bolts and holes worn? But balancing will not solve this problem either.

Thus I say I don't believe you need to balance the shaft IMHO. Every balancing guy I have ever used always says ( while sucking air through teeth) " yeah it need some adjustment, not easy to do, but its perfect now"
(excuse the cynic in me)

cheers
Rohan

PS I know of no one who removes the diff input shaft / flange to balance with the prop shaft. I also know of no reason why it should be needed unless you have significant wear in the mating flanges in which case you need new parts not a balance.

[robertverhey]

I've only ever had one ford diff centre rebuilt, it was a 3.54 so I figured worth investing some money in. Turned out to be a mistake, both crown and pinion needed replacing. All up bill was around $A500 and it never was completely silent after all that. The next time I needed a 3.54 centre I just bought one from a 2 litre escort from the wreckers $A95. Absolutely perfect and silent. So I always just replace, as refurbishment is just not cost effective in my view, with so many old fords about as donors.

Just reading Rohan's response re propshaft balancing, one thing did occur to me, and that's the importance of tapping the universal so the four caps abut the four circlips, after the joint is installed. I guess if that's not done equally all around there could be and ever so slight off-centredness....or a bit of binding.

That said the ?lan propshaft does very little lateral work, as both gearbox end and diff are more or less semi-solidly mounted, unlike the cortina /escort live axle setup

[KevJ+2]

As Rohan says, when they suck in the air you know it's gonna cost
Unfortunately, most of us have to defer to what we hope is superior knowledge and hope that you get honesty and a good job at a fair price - not always easy to find. With some things you can see the work completed and maybe even check it over. Something like a diff which comes back sealed, you have to hope that all the parts inside that you've been charged for are actually fitted and set up correctly , it does make you think
As for my propshaft, I bought the car as a non runner so balancing the prop made sense. As it was, it was re-weighted but not by much, I was also told it wasn't out by much.
William, I can't understand why they would jack up the price, I took it there with new UJs fitted and collected it about a week later, it seemed to be a standard price they gave me before I even went there - very strange.
All the best,
Kev.

[William2]

Thanks for all your advice. Having weighed up all the pros and cons I don't think I will bother having it balanced. Let alone the additional cost.