clutch pedal travel

[bfcscc]

Hello All:

I have a 1969 Lotus Elan +2, and I need some advice on a clutch fix.

The clutch on my car engages over a very short portion of the pedal travel. The worst of it is that the portion of the travel pedal is at the top of the pedal throw -- after lots of "dead" travel.

So, initial take-offs are a challenge due to both the abruptness of the engagement and also because of the fact that it is difficult to estimate when the abruptness is going to occur (given all the pedal travel without engagement that precedes it).

Both the master and slave cylinders have been rebuilt, and this did little if anything to address the problem.

Does anyone have have suggestions on how to make the engagement of the clutch occur more smoothly over a longer portion of the pedal's path?

Thanks.

Brian

[gjz30075]

Has is always been this way? Sounds like a broken spring in the pressure plate. Elanern on this forum (Ernie Peters) is in your area and maybe can provide an extra set of eyes.

Greg Z

[oldelanman]

Hi Brian, welcome to the forum.
Lack of clearance on the slave cylinder pushrod could cause the clutch to operate at the top of the pedal travel - check you have 2mm clearance between the adjusting nut and the clutch lever.

If that's OK then I would suspect the clutch disc may be on it's way out.

[bfcscc]

Thank you very much for the suggestions thus far. I will follow up on these.

I have owned the car for less than a year. The clutch has behaved this way in the time I've owned it. When I asked the previous, long-time owner about it, he said the clutch had been "grabby" for as long as he could remember.

Brian

[john.p.clegg]

Check the diameter of the Master cylinder...

John

[bfcscc]

Well, I'm certainly glad I joined the forum. All of the tips are much appreciated.

I'm not proud to reveal that I may need some additional clarification. My understanding of the role played by all the parts of the clutch assembly is pretty limited.

If it isn't too much trouble, when you suggest a potential fix -- your time and patience permitting -- please explain why you think this fix might be related to the specific issue I'm experiencing. I'd really like to use this as an opportunity to learn much more about exactly how a clutch does what it does.

Again, I understand that everyone's time is limited. If you only have time to make a quick suggestion, I will follow up on it even if I'm not entirely clear on why I'm doing it!

Thanks again, everyone.

[Quart Meg Miles]

Welcome indeed Brian, good choice. I've only been on the site since October and have learnt a huge amount despite owning my Elan for over forty years.

When I first owned it I had an IN-OUT clutch which made for interesting getaways with the early doughnuts. The clutch was soaked in oil and the problem disappeared once I changed the plate. The long pedal travel is usually due, as noted earlier, to a large gap in the slave push rod so should be the first port of call for you. Hang in there, chum, it'll come right.

[john.p.clegg]

Brian

"Check the diameter of the Master cylinder..."

You should have a 5/8" Master cylinder and a 7/8" Slave cylinder...it's like using a see-saw,it has to be balanced but moving the pivot will give too much/little travel or too much/little effort...

John

[oldelanman]

Brian,
If you don't have one already I would recommend getting yourself a copy of the Workshop Manual - it's very helpful in understanding how things are put together and vital if you intend to carry out any repairs yourself. The Elan manual has some good illustrations of the clutch and I would think the +2 manual is probably the same. Also there are lots of clips on youtube which can be informative......this one on how a clutch works for example....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRlPE3IpBSw

[rgh0]

A clutch that grabs is almost certainly due to a problem with the internals of flywheel./ clutch plate / pressure plate assembly.

Lots of potential issues but oil contamination or worn surfaces would be the most common. You really need the engine out and an overhaul of the clutch assembly if you want to fix the grabbing. Ensure you get the flywheel face ground and most likely you will need a new clutch plate and pressure plate assembly. Get the new assembly balanced and ensure the flywheel goes back on the crank in the same postion it came off.

Engagement high in the pedal movement can be normally easily be eliminated with adjustment of the clearance of the slave cylinder pushrod on the lever as others have said. If it stays near the top with the right clearance on the push rod then there is something wrong with the internals, maybe a worn clutch plate or broken diaphram springs

cheers
Rohan

[bfcscc]

Hello All:

Thanks again to everyone who previously sent in tips. With the help of a local mechanic, I have been trying to work my way through them -- starting with the easiest/least expensive ones.

As you will recall, I experience a lot of travel when releasing the clutch pedal before the clutch begins to engage and then when it does engage, it engages very abruptly over very little additional pedal travel. My question is what to do with the return spring while checking the clearance between the tapered conical nut and the clutch fork -- leave it in place or disconnect it? If I leave it connected and completely back off the locknut and adjusting nut, the spring pulls the fork very far forward down the push rod. On the other hand, if I disconnect it, I'm uncertain where to position the fork when setting the gap between it and the adjusting nut.

Thanks again for any tips.

Brian

[bfcscc]

Ah! Ignore that last question. I see in the manual that I need to disconnect the spring.

Still, I'm uncertain about where to locate the fork while setting the gap.

[oldelanman]

Ah! Ignore that last question. I see in the manual that I need to disconnect the spring.

Still, I'm uncertain about where to locate the fork while setting the gap.

Make sure the slave cylinder piston is fully returned and the pushrod is in contact with the piston. Pull the end of the release arm (fork) away from the slave cylinder so that the other end is in contact with the release bearing then measure/adjust the clearance.

[Peter +2]

I would say that the clutch on my Plus 2 operates and grabs in the same way you describe. I have replaced the master and slave cylinders (supplied by the usual good guys) and made sure the MC actuating rod is of the correct length as the new ones tend to be to short. I have the adjusted the SC actuating rod too.

In the end I have put the grabbing and travel down three things

1) I have become too soft after years of driving in an auto
2) The grab is down to the competition clutch fitted by the PO having been told that standard clutch cover plates are no longer available.
3) The clutch is worn.

As for the latter it will have to wait until the engine gets pulled at some point.

Peter

[bfcscc]

Thanks Roger. I'll try this again following your instructions.

Thanks Peter. I have begun to wonder the same things about my car. In fact, I have an e-mail out to the PO of my car right now trying to confirm that everything is stock.