Remove body from chassis with engine in or out?

[Certified Lotus]

I am preparing to separate my S1 body from the chassis to install a new 26R Chassis. I'm fortunate enough to have a lift in my garage so it should be easier than without one.

After reading a large number of posts on the forum and reading Brian Buckland's excellent workshop manual, I was wondering is it better to remove the engine and trans first before separating the body from the chassis OR just take off the carbs, header and water intake to remove the body with the engine & trans left intact?

Buckland also suggest's removing the suspension while the body is attached to the car versus removing the suspension after the frame is separate from the body. I would like to know forum members thoughts on this.

Any and all comments and insights would be appreciated.

[mrdoow]

Removing and installing the body works best for me with the engine, headers, suspension, etc. installed in the chassis. Access to all that stuff is better after the body is removed. Go slowly and watch the footwell clearances. Also, make sure everything is disconnected when using the lift. Otherwise, the lift will disconnect things you forgot in a manner that may not be what you wanted (voice of experience here).

Here is a video link of my body going back on to the chassis https://vimeo.com/117983994

Gary

[Certified Lotus]

Hey Gary, Great video! Man after my own heart as I usually make videos on many things I do in my life (just look up GlenElectronic on YouTube, there are a few Lotus related videos on my channel).

Now you can't tell me you had the rolling chassis perfectly aligned the first time you brought the body down on the lift? Any suggestions in using the lift regarding placement of the arms?

I made special pads for the lift arms to increase the area the car would rest on. See attached photo.

What kind of things did you forget to disconnect? I'm making a list to hopefully not forget something.

Really nice looking ?lan! Who made the roll hoop?

[mrdoow]

The roll hoop is manufactured by Safety Devices http://www.safetydevices.com/motorsport/products/roll-cage/Lotus+Elan+S1-1962-1964-2-door/95/956/ Tony Thompson is the dist. in UK. You may be able to find one here in the US.

The hoop does limit seat travel a bit. So, If you are quite tall, that may present a problem. I'm 5' 10" and have no problem. There is also a lot of discussion regarding roll hoops, street use and seatbelt in the various forums. May be worth studying prior to your final decision. I have their hoop and side impact bars installed. I'm not sure how much side impact protection the bars will provide as they are only 8" above ground. I did read one account of how thankful one elan owner was for the side impact bars. He ended up totaling his car by sliding into a ditch. He gave credit to the bars for saving the occupants lives.

I locate the standard pads on my lift to each corner of the floor pan (photos below). This works well with body only or fully assembled car. You will note the rear pads are only making half contact as I needed room to fabricate/fit a reinforcement for the outboard seat track attach studs. [img]

DSC00648.JPG

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I have reinforced the floor pan with carbon on both surfaces, but this location worked well with the original FRP. The most difficult car to hoist on the lift is an Elise. I have to admit I am only human, so for the video I did have a rehearsal or two.

What did I forget to disconnect before lifting? The problem with using a lift is that it is too easy to take the body off and put it back on. For me the result is to do it for every little thing that needs better access. I forgot to disconnect the inner steering column shaft from the steering rack. The lift didn't hesitate at all until the shaft had a significant bend in it. OOPS!

Additional support for leaving the chassis and running gear whole is shown in the photos. You may be able to see that at this time mine is set up as a test and run-in fixture. Good thing since I have some oil leaks to take care of and may have to pull the engine out to make the fix.

[fatboyoz]

Glen,
Heater valve and rearmost carbie studs not to be forgotten if removing body with engine fitted. Headers/extractors should be okay to be left fitted?
Cheers,
Colin.

I am preparing to separate my S1 body from the chassis to install a new 26R Chassis. I'm fortunate enough to have a lift in my garage so it should be easier than without one.

After reading a large number of posts on the forum and reading Brian Buckland's excellent workshop manual, I was wondering is it better to remove the engine and trans first before separating the body from the chassis OR just take off the carbs, header and water intake to remove the body with the engine & trans left intact?

Buckland also suggest's removing the suspension while the body is attached to the car versus removing the suspension after the frame is separate from the body. I would like to know forum members thoughts on this.

Any and all comments and insights would be appreciated.

[Certified Lotus]

Gary, thanks for supplying the photos of the lift points. I smiled when you said you remove the body every time you have work to do on the car because it's so easy (with a lift). I used to do the same with my track Exige, always removed the rear clam whenever I did work on the engine or suspension.

Why did you reinforce the floor area the lift points are at ? Was there damage or are you being proactive about stress point?

With regard to the roll hoop, I know many believe a street car shouldn't have them without 5 point harness and helmet usage. I just feel a little bit exposed in this open car without it. I'm way past the stage of aggressive driving on the street (that is what the track is for) but I do worry about the other crazy drivers on the back roads. If you don't mind my asking, how did you come to the decision on installing a roll hoop?

Will put on my list remember to remove steering column!

Colin, appreciate your comment about the rear carb studs. Had forgotten about those.

[mrdoow]

Glen, the roll hoop and FRP reinforcement work come from a lot of thought about safety and exposure. So, the floor reinforcement started after finding a rusted truss on the passenger side.

The floor pan to rocker panel joint had failed allowing water intrusion. It appeared the joint failed due to a lot of flexing, so while repairing the failed joint, I decided to add a little "light weight" stiffness to the floors with a layer of carbon fiber both inside and outside. I also added some Kevlar for abrasion resistance to the areas that were scarred from road debris impacts. Photos below

While the door frame was open for the truss repair, the work led to adding a layer of carbon reinforcement around the door frame and the building of a carbon composite side impact door beam. More of that safety/exposure thinking.

The roll hoop came available at this time also and was in line with my safety thoughts.

[Certified Lotus]

Impressive work Gary. Looks like a lot of thought went into your decisions on adding some additional safety reinforcement.

Looks like your car is fairly close to completion. Will it be done this summer?

[mrdoow]

Hopefully.

[Certified Lotus]

I've developed a list for me to follow when I remove the chassis from the body this weekend. Used the great resources from a number of prior posts to develop this list. Anything I have forgotten?

Removing Lotus Elan S1 Body From Frame
(With engine and transmission left intact)
o Remove bonnet
o Disconnect battery cable
o Drain radiator, engine, transmission, rear differential
o Disconnect hoses, remove radiator
o Disconnect vacuum lines for head lights
o Disconnect water temp sensor and heater control valve on head
o Disconnect steering column, Remove the pinch bolt from the steering shaft coupling located near the front cross member. Under the instrument panel loosen the two U bolts securing the steering shaft. Pull the steering wheel back about 1 inch to disengage the splined steering shaft from the coupling.
o Disconnect throttle cable
o Remove airbox, carburetors and rear studs
o Unfasten and remove tailpipe/muffler /exhaust pipe from header
o Disconnect speedo cable, parking brake cable
o Disconnect clutch slave cylinder
o Disconnect ignition switch wire from starter and all ground wires to frame
o Disconnect brake lines from master cylinder
o Disconnect oil pressure line from block
o Disconnect primary ignition and high tension wires to distributor from coil
o Disconnect fuel line from fuel pump
o Remove transmission shift lever, plug tranny opening with wadded paper towel
o Remove horns mounted on front body/chassis through bolts
o Remove 12 UNC body chassis bolts from underneath
o Behind dash at the tunnel top, remove two UNF bolts on each side
o Behind carpet panel below the convertible top storage area remove the two
o UNF body/rear strut bolts
o Nearby on the outboard sides remove the bolts and clevis holding the seat
o To lighten the body for lift off: Remove fuel tank, Remove seats
o Remove the black ground wire connected to the differential rubber mount in boot.
o Remove the two seat belt inboard ring bolts that screw into the transmission tunnel portion of the frame.
o Remove the large rubber hole plug on the right side of the transmission tunnel, used to access the drive shaft u-joint.
o There are 16 bolts holding the body onto the chassis
o Check for any shims on frame and mark locations of them

[billwill]

Check the top part of the seat belts, some types may be screwed through the body into the rear suspension turrets. You don't specifically mention undoing the chassis end of the earth lead of the battery.


I took the doors off and boot lid off to lighten the body, but you should be OK with the poweref lift.

I don't think you need to drain the diff, gearbox and engine oil until later when you take them off the rolling chassis.

[Certified Lotus]

Thanks Bill. I didn't mean to suggest draining the oil from the engine. I will drain the oil from the gear box and differential while its up in the air on a lift as my oil collection can is fairly high. Plus I'll be removing those parts fairly quickly to put on my new 26 R chassis as well as changing out the bearings and drive shafts.

[mrdoow]

Glen,
Sounds like you are ready. Your list looks quite complete. Lift slowly. As gaps and spaces begin to form, stop lifting and check for connections that were missed.

Enjoy your weekend.

[fatboyoz]

Glen,
A couple of things on your list:

No need to disconnect the fuel line from the mechanical pump. The fuel line runs through the chassis, so remains when body is lifted.

When removing fuel tank, for lightness when lifting, the fuel line needs to be pulled/pushed back through the body at this point.

Cheers,
Colin.