Lotus Elan

How much should I pay for a +2?

PostPost by: Grib » Thu Mar 20, 2008 10:06 am

Hi, I have decided to buy an Elan +2 but am a bit confused by the range of prices for what appear to be cars in a similar condition, for example on carandclassic.co.uk at the moment there is a green 130/5 for ?8700 and two JPS editions (are these just a different colour?) for ?14,000 & ?15,995. I don't want to buy a restoration project and intend to use the car every day, could anyone give me an idea of what is a fair price - of the cars I mentioned above either one looks like a bargain or the other two are way overpriced. Also could anyone recommend someone who could inspect a car before I buy it; it is more than likely I will have to travel a long way to get a car and I dont really want to turn up to see a pile of rubbish with a shiny paint job.
Thanks, Ian
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PostPost by: zeteclotus » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:41 pm

Genuine 5 speeds are worth more as the gearbox is quite rare.

Many have been badly rebuilt and have given it a reputation for a worse gear change. Usually by people who have a 4 speed and are trying to sell it. A correctly built one makes the car much easier to drive every day. I would say a must.

i really like the 5 speed version. + it comes with the nicer interior alternator (better electrics) the later bodies are better made (usually)
More powerful 130 engine.

Some would say a genuine JPS would carry a premium price.

As to value they are definitely rising a few years ago a good car could be had for about 5-6K now ones in need of a lot of work go for that.

A good car is worth 8 to 10K 8 k for an early 4 speed 10K for a late 5 speed in good condition.

A spyder zetec in very good condition costs about ?30k to build and sell after use for between 10K and 15K

I have owned a few +2 over the years sell the zetec last year.
I should sell my standard one as i need the garage back, but just can not as the smile it puts on my face every time I use it is too good. even after 10 years of owner ship.
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PostPost by: ppnelan » Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:18 pm

The traditional answer, if you want an 'everyday' car, is AS MUCH AS YOU CAN AFFORD... :wink:

If you don't want to do ANY work then you'll be looking at ?7-10K. Buy privately for the added 'excitement' of possibly getting a bargain or a wreck, or pay more at a Lotus dealer/specialist if you want a 'warranty' & peace of mind.

If you use it for reasonably long dual-carriage-/motor-way journeys, a 5-speed will make it a comfortable cruiser. If you only do short/B-road journeys, a 4-speed will be more fun.

Suggest you buy some books about them first, so you know what you're letting yourself & your family in for... :wink: :lol:

:arrow: Matthew
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PostPost by: Elanintheforest » Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:33 pm

It makes a big difference whether you?re buying privately or from a Lotus specialist?and there aren?t many of those. Genuine low mileage / low owner cars with full history are always going to be worth a premium, but the black JPS you refer to, as a private sale, looks to be on the high side. May be worth a bit of negotiation though. Incidentally, the JPS only came in black with a gold roof?don?t know what that other non-black JPS is trying to be.

Remember that these are 35 ? 40 year old cars that, if neglected, could give a lot of trouble even when they were in their first flush of youth. A one owner low mileage car will still have had a lot of things done to it over the years, or will need it now. I have a JPS Plus 2 that had 1 previous owner, 38k miles and never been touched?off the road since 1982, it needs everything doing, apart from the interior!

If you are paying ?7k - ?10k for a private car, ?10k - ?15k for one from Paul Matty or other Elan specialists, make sure that they have full documentation to prove their worth. That is top money, and the cars will need to have had a full and proper restoration?not just a paint job, carpets and some shock absorbers. The invoices will be an inch thick?and it will have a new chassis. If you don?t know what you?re looking at, go to a specialist?.at least you will have some comeback.

If you?re ever over this way you?re welcome to come and have a look at my cars. Several are excellent examples of what can go wrong and what to look out for, one or two are good! And we keep Manx Loughton sheep to make you feel at home.

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PostPost by: Jason1 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:18 pm

Ian

The one in the 'For sale' section looks pretty good.

Jason
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PostPost by: bcmc33 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:36 pm

This one looks the right money considering what has been spent.

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/404599.htm

An Elan.net member, I'm sure, and you won't have to travel far to see and try it out.

I'm syre you won't need a 5 speed on the IOM.
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PostPost by: Grib » Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:35 pm

I'd be happy spending the money on the car on the pistonheads website but I would have to change the interior, if there was no orange leather it would be lovely. The orange cam cover and airbox would have to go too but that would be an easy job. It seems a lot better value than the JPS for ?14K especially as it comes with a replacement chassis as well.
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PostPost by: gordonlund » Fri Mar 21, 2008 11:59 am

Ian,

If you can, get yourself over to Donington next Sat / Sun for the Lotus Show. +2's and every other Lotus will be there, including me and my old +2. If you really intend to buy a Lotus this is one event you can't afford to miss.

All the best
Gordon

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PostPost by: stugilmour » Fri Mar 21, 2008 4:51 pm

I see this one posted on the for sale portion of the forum. I like the very complete and fair sounding description, although the photo's could better show the problem areas the seller has described. Centre console area looks modified, but I believe parts are available to put to stock if desired. Overall condition looks very good. Perhaps worth a look to get a sense.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... otohosting
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PostPost by: jimj » Fri Mar 21, 2008 5:52 pm

I`m surprised no-one has said, yet, that you really don`t need to spend so much. Buy the best you can and save money overall but ?8K should buy a minter. All this talk of ?10K+ is, I humbly suggest, wishful thinking on the part of owners who have invested much more than their cars are worth on the open market.
Do go to Donnington to get a feel for the market but do bear in mind that what people are asking isn`t necessarily what they get.
Good luck.
Jim
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PostPost by: Elanintheforest » Fri Mar 21, 2008 10:30 pm

I wish I could find a ?minter? for ?7k or ?8k. The last one I saw was in Mattys, which had been restored by Peter Day (at a cost of ?25k) and had a ticket price of ?17.5 ish. Quite a bargain when you consider that the owner probably paid over ?30k in total including buying the car. That was in showroom condition, albeit with some non-original bits (though very close) and certainly not concourse.

I?ve seen some nice cars for ?7k to ?8k..good honest workhorses, but a long long way off being in showroom condition, which is what I assume ?minter? means. And showroom condition is a very long way off being concourse?a totally different league again.

Trouble is these terms are used very freely, and mean different things to different people. I agree Jim that a solid Plus 2 can be obtained for ?6k or ?7k or ?8k, but I doubt that every component will have been overhauled / replaced, the bodywork and interior returned to as-new condition, and the whole car as original, which after 40 years would be required to get a true ?minter?.

Just a view, and I don?t have an axe to grind. My Plus 2s are all in need of some work, some need lots, and none of them are worth the big money.

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PostPost by: Expat+2 » Sat Mar 22, 2008 6:12 am

As a real world example, I bought my 1973 +2 S130 privately in the UK for ?5250 last year. It's had 3 owners, fully documented 75,000 miles, mechanically excellent with Spyder chassis, engine rebuilt by PO. I needed to spend a few hundred on things like new dampers and brake discs, but now needs nothing.
It desperately needs painting though. I suspect most cars in this price range need ?3000-?4000 spending to get them in excellent (but not pristine) condition.
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PostPost by: jimj » Sat Mar 22, 2008 9:23 am

Yes, Mark, you`re right, "minter" was a bad choice of word. I meant "very good". The one mentioned above, on e-bay now, is described as excellent, though the chassis is described as inspected and fine, it is not said to have been replaced. If it has been replaced then this is the sort of car I`m thinking of. Perfect paint, everything working, 12 months MOT and I doubt it will reach more than ?7,500. If it is as described and I was wanting one then I`d buy it.
For the cynics out there, you know who you are !!! No, I have no connection with the seller !
Jim
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PostPost by: bcmc33 » Sat Mar 22, 2008 10:44 am

Please let me know where I can get a proper paint job done for ?4k.

The best quote I've received was a minimum of ?6k + VAT and 12 weeks to do it.

This price was for a Sprint - I guess a +2 whould cost more.

If a +2 has new or excellent paint, then this has to be taken into consideration.

If I were in the market for another car I would always choose the best painted as the mechanicals are relatively easy to repair or update by most of us on this forum. Painting takes real experts - thats why its so expensive.
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PostPost by: barefoot » Sat Mar 22, 2008 2:57 pm

I am the owner of the orange plus 2 on Pistonheads. I had the car inspected by 2 "specialists" when I bought the car and spent lots of money on faults they found but was told the chassis was fine. This week a gentleman who knows these cars like the back of his hand came to view and after 10 mins in the garage emerged to say lovely car had lots of money spent on it and the interior is finished off superbly..........but the chassis is buggered!

He then proceeded to explain and unbelievably offered to help me swap it over with the new Spyder I had bought originally when I purchased the car. So this is going on over Easter:

Image
Image
Image

So when someone says like I did the cars has only done 56,000 miles chassis inspected by specialists and is fine that just might not be the case. I also agree re the money spent on a plus 2 to get it into "mint" condition is thousands and then not worth nowhere near that. But they are definitely appreciated more nowadays and have gone up in price.

The JPS on it's original chassis at 14K is a bit too much IMO but good one's are now 10K and a bit above as they should be when you look at decent TR6 prices that admittedly have the benefit of open top motoring but are not in the same league as a drivers car.

Back to the garage???
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