Early +2 history and engine/cam question

[Tim509]

Hi All,

I’m trying to get more information on a 1968 Lotus Elan +2 that I purchased earlier this year.

It is chassis 50/0624 and has the registration 390PBJ which it seems to have had assigned most of it’s life.

The body (chassis) plate states the engine number as E16621B and this matches the engine fitted. Interestingly though the V5 document states the engine number as LP12122LBA which is anomalous.

Referencing Miles Wilkins’ book to check the prefix suggests the ‘E’ prefix is an S/E Weber engine as fitted to the Lotus Cortina 1963 onwards and that the early +2 engines were prefixed ‘F’.

My engine is fitted with type 31 40DCOE Webers but checking the cams shows no single groove which suggests standard B-type cams have been fitted at some stage (the receipts I have show it had new valves as part of a previous engine rebuild). I’m assuming I will have lost some 10+ bhp as a result of this?

I’m not after out and out power and want an engine that is tractable so wondered about fitting QED 360 or Piper 270 cams as I don’t want to undertake serious head work at this stage so want something that will be a fairly simple swap.

Anyone able to provide any information on the car history, the engine prefix question and the cam change?

Many thanks!

[elans3]

Don't assume about the cams. Perhaps more likely to have had aftermarket cams fitted at some time in it's life, rather than having had standard cams put in an SE engine. they could have been reprofiled from a standard old cam, or may have been ground from new blanks.Have a look at the rear end of the cams next time you have the cam cover off, and see if there's any numbers on the rear. Piper, for example, generally used to engrave their cam numbers there.

[ncm]

Hi Tim , according to the list of Plus 2 numbers that used to be on the net , LP12122LBA was the number of the original fitment engine.
Brian.

Edited to add that the chassis plate on my early 68 Plus 2 does not have the engine number engraved on it.

[ncm]

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=46767&hilit=serial+numbers
Here you go..
Brian.

[Tim509]

Hi Brian, thanks for the reply and link to the information. The only thing that is strange is that the engine number E16621B is written (scribed) on the engine plate.

[ncm]

Hi Tim, As I've said in my edit, my plate does not have the engine number on it . If your car came out of the factory in the same condition then perhaps a previous owner changed the engine and then scribed the number of the replacement on the plate.
Brian.

[Shiny_kit]

My car (50/836) has no engine number on the plate either.

[JJDraper]

It's easy enough to get new, repro body/chassis plates. I suggest that this is what happened in your case. Matching engine numbers are pretty rare as engines were regularly swapped out in the day. Not sure if there is any premium in value for a matching set of numbers (in the UK at least).

A few years ago these repro plates were all over ebay. I bought one as my old (original) one was a bit tatty and though a new one would look better, but was advised not to do this. The actual printing of the plates changed over time, but I have never seen a time line of what plates were appropriate for which year as the trade names of the lubricants changed - a nice research job for someone!

You should really get the DVLA to update the record for the car, as it is a potential legal problem to run with engine number not matching the official records.

Jeremy

[jono]

My car (50/836) has no engine number on the plate either.

That's interesting as I recently acquired 50/0837 which I'm currently restoring

...I would be interested to see some pictures, I am guessing it's Carnival Red which seemed to be an almost default colour for '68 cars! I'm changing mine to Cirrus White.

Confusingly the body unit number on mine is 0863 - I have never understood why Lotus did not make the body and unit numbers the same, does anyone know the reason?

[Shiny_kit]

PM sent

[Donels]

The engine number is scribed on my chassis plate and is the correct engine according to records, so it looks like it was normal Lotus practice. Maybe engine were allocated late in the build.

Like you my V5 had an incomplete number, in this case it was unit number. I wrote to DVLA explaining it was incorrect and provided photographic evidence to show what it should be. It was updated with no problems, but this is not guaranteed according to others who have experienced problems. Maybe a letter from the Lotus archivist, if he still exists, would help.

[JJDraper]

Oooh! working with DVLA & numbers - a favourite topic. My +2 came with the body number incorrectly stating that it was the chassis number (sorry steel sub assembly) of the replacement Spyder chassis. This is quite common and can obscure the history of a car. DVLA (classics section - yes they have one) are understandably suspicious of any changes to chassis numbers now, less so with engines, as this is the identity of a car. I understand there have been numerous cases in the past of unscrupulous dealers fraudulently creating multiple copies of the same car, especially if there is history and provenance which would add value. A few years ago, a Lotus Cortina chassis plate went for over £10k on ebay, just for the plate, so that a 'genuine' car could be built. This is much less of a problem with our cars (apart from a few notable exceptions) but officialdom doesn't like it and so are rightly suspicious.

Our cars (including the Elan) have a particular problem in that the identity of the car is the fibreglass tub, not the steelwork that keep the wheels in place - the steel subassembly (AKA a chassis). My experience is 10 years ago, when I replaced the elderly replacement Spyder chassis with a new one and took the opportunity to put things right. After some to-ing and fro-ing, with photos and a standard letter from Lotus Cars explaining the situation vis the steel sub assembly and the identity of the car, DVLA agreed to put things right. Phew!

I believe some owners stamp the chassis with the correct original Tub number, but I don't think this was a standard practice in the day (ready to be corrected).

Some cars have the tub number moulded in the bulkhead or scribed in the car somewhere, including inside the doors but don't count on it.. If chassis (sorry) Tub number 800 is still on the road, I have your doors!

Jeremy

[trw99]

Elans have Unit Numbers. That is their one key identifier. They also have Engine Nos, Paint Codes and Body Nos, as well of course, Registration Nos in the UK
They have never had Tub Nos. They have had Chassis Nos, very early on in production, but they were unified with Unit Nos after approx a year.
I wrote an article for Club Lotus News on the subject of VIN numbers a few years ago and have posted it up on here once or twice in the past. I’m away at the moment so unable to post it again currently.

Tim

[JJDraper]

What is the difference between a fibreglass tub number and unit number? I only used the term to assign identity to the main body shell rather than the chassis or any other part of the car. If a unit is re-shelled things get complicated re identity, a bit like the 200 year old broom.

Jeremy