Russia

PostPost by: rgh0 » Tue Feb 21, 2023 10:51 am

AshleyPark wrote:Rohan

It’s interesting, yet pretty predictable, you choose to ignore the messages of those you don’t like, dismissing any alternative view point to your own as being less worthy rantings from emotional “peace activists”!

Perun being more veracious about the situation in Ukraine because he’s a smooth talking Aussie being a case in point. I notice he doesn’t mention the bombing of the Nordstream 2 pipeline, perhaps it doesn’t fit his cosy narrative eh?

Of course, what you believe is your own personal choice, as you say. However, don’t be too quick to assume that we live in a society that’s any more free than the one in Russia. You only have to see what’s happened to your fellow countryman, Julian Assange, to realise that.

Freedom of speech is dying fast here, I see even Roald Dahl’s children's books are being rewritten now!!


Let break this down

1. I did not dismiss or ignore their ranting I merely pointed out that it had little logic and was emotional and inconsistent, all of which I believe are accurate observation of their behaviours and words

2. Yes Perun is very extensive in his comments and with the data provided to support that, unlike Ritter and others. He is also very careful to remain neutral unlike them. No so entertaining but in the end more valuable. He has not yet commented on Nordstream 2 explosions in terms of trying to say who did it as there is as yet no evidence except "annonymous sources" claimed by one individual. In the end it does not really matter who did it. No one was injured and the pipe line was shutdown before hand and never going to be fully commisoned anytime in the near future. Also Russia had been systematically using "technical problems" to have random shutdowns of other pipelines. It could have been US, UK, Ulraine, Russian, Swedish, Estonian, Polish or Norwegian or Wagner.

3.Yes freedom is threatened in all societies including the USA by vested interests, but examples like Assange are fortunately the exception in the USA rather than the rule as in Russia. The USA would benefit, in my opinion, from a greater focus on freedom of speech (the first amendment loved by democrats) and a lesser focus on freedom to arm yourself with assault weapons ( the current interpretation of the 2nd amendment loved by republcans)

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PostPost by: AshleyPark » Tue Feb 21, 2023 11:09 am

Good stuff!

Have a look at this Rohan. I'm no Trump or Fox News supporter but I think it's spot on:

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/tucker- ... destuction
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Tue Feb 21, 2023 12:01 pm

Ashley

Spot on in what aspects?

Has the war in Ukraine driven Russia to have closer ties with China faster than would have occured otherwise..... Probably yes. But that does not signficantly add to the growing might of China as an economy or to the growing risk of a clash between China and the West and other Asian states. If anything Russia as a vassal state to China may lessen tensions and the risk of future wars

East Palestine train derailment appears to be an attempt to link other issues to the Ukraine war and blame Biden for both and that defies any rational logic except in the eyes of Scott Ritter.

Promoting Trumps "foreign policy" versus other approaches by Tucker you could debate, but most of it seems to have a thread of isolationism which arises from time to time in the USA, combined with self interest to get foreign goverments to support Trumps private investments, plus the need to do Putins bidding due to whatever blackmail Putin had on him from misdemeanors in Russian Hotel rooms. The one good thing of Trumps approach was to make the European Nato countries realise they could not rely on total USA support and that they needed to do more themsleves than they had since the fall of the Soviet Union. The Russian invasion of Ukraine has just increased that incentive.

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PostPost by: AshleyPark » Tue Feb 21, 2023 1:16 pm

It’s interesting that Biden pulled American troops out of Afghanistan after 20 years of occupation because, as he put it, “it was past time to end the forever wars, which have cost us untold blood and treasure." Pledging an end to the huge expenditure of tax payer’s dollars on arms and corrupt overseas regimes was his stated aim as part of his blueprint for foreign policy.

Well that didn’t last long did it? Those promises have gone totally out of the window. All lies. Official US spending to prop up the Ukraine military effort has already reached $150 billion!

What Carlson is stressing is that all of that expenditure has been pointless when it only serves to promote a Russia, China alliance, whilst at the same time taking away funds and attention from vital issues at home.

Nobody is blaming Biden for what happened in Ohio (well perhaps they are because the railroad infrastructure has been woefully underfunded), what they are doing is pointing out Biden’s hypocrisy and that he’s leading them towards an ever spiralling crisis with another superpower.

Above all, Carlson elucidates clearly, the irony of being led into a possible world war on the grounds of preserving democracy - without even as much as a democratic mandate!
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PostPost by: h20hamelan » Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:51 pm

On that topic...  Really not looking good.  "Richard noted that the biggest nightmare for the US isn’t just Chinese nuclear modernization, but that there would be closing ties between Beijing and Moscow — leaving the US, for the first time in history, up against two nuclear competitors instead of just one."

COLD WAR II: China successfully tests ‘phantom space strike’ weapon which can overwhelm an enemy’s missile defence systems ahead of a nuclear attack.
China has successfully tested a ‘phantom space strike’ – a new tactic to overwhelm and sabotage missile defences by emitting fake target signals from space.
Military engineers announced earlier this month they had completed a computer simulation and achieved positive results.
The tactic is designed to overwhelm the enemy on the basis that there is only so much a missile defence system would be able to cope with.
Previously: STRATCOM Chief Warns Of Chinese ‘Strategic Breakout.’ “It really doesn’t matter why China is and continues to grow and modernize. What matters is they are building the capability to execute any plausible nuclear employment strategy — the last brick in the wall of a military capable of coercion.”
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PostPost by: h20hamelan » Tue Feb 21, 2023 6:18 pm

And further to this Canada has given China the worlds only caesium mine
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PostPost by: nomad » Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:19 am

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PostPost by: rgh0 » Wed Feb 22, 2023 9:29 am

nomad wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXzr2JXSzHc&ab_channel=TheJimmyDoreShow

Kurt


So ?

Are you looking for a general rebuttal of all the BS in that video or is there a specific element of BS you want me to address ?

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PostPost by: UAB807F » Wed Feb 22, 2023 9:50 am

rgh0 wrote:Are you looking for a general rebuttal of all the BS in that video or is there a specific element of BS you want me to address ?


:)

I'm no fan of Harris but in this case she's got a more sensible viewpoint than the expert who seems to think that Russia just wants it all to end.
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Wed Feb 22, 2023 11:32 am

Bonjour David/Ashley,
You talk about USA pulling out of Afghanistan but Russia pulled out also.
That makes a draw or should i say double withdrawl.
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PostPost by: h20hamelan » Wed Feb 22, 2023 3:12 pm

Caesium is being given to China

http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/2023/02 ... trudeau-3/

And I am shocked/appalled it just has not been in the media until this today.
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PostPost by: nomad » Wed Feb 22, 2023 7:16 pm

rgh0 wrote:
nomad wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXzr2JXSzHc&ab_channel=TheJimmyDoreShow

Kurt


So ?

Are you looking for a general rebuttal of all the BS in that video or is there a specific element of BS you want me to address ?

cheers
Rohan


Rohan, all I can do is sigh.

Lets go back to your favorite sites point of view that any number of people could have been responsible for blowing up the pipeline. That is the best indication of how biased I believe your sources are.

When I heard that the pipeline had been blown up, from my son, who immediately had bought into the propaganda machines claim that Russia had blown up their own pipeline, my thought was instantly that the US had done it. As I pointed out to him, just use logic. Why would Russia blow up the pipeline that they had invested billions in? If they wished to deny Germany gas all they needed to do was close a valve! Long before the pipeline went up in smoke, Biden was threatening to get rid of it. Even before that I saw some fat cat, [Soros???], talking about the threat of Germany getting too chummy with Russia. The fact that if Germanys technological ability was allied with Russia's vast resources, they could become a dominate economic force in the world. Even as it was being built concern was being expressed in this country.

From the beginning of this conflict I have NOT been against Russia. I consider Putin no prince. It is obvious he plans on being the new Czar of Russia for life and he obtained his position by allowing a lot of oligarchs to enrich themselves at the expense of the Russian people. Having said that ,though, he has shown himself to be far more intelligent than the fools and crooks we have running this country! Now they are threatening China as well. China has shown far more intelligence as well and pushing two nuclear powers closer together is showing real idiocy!!!

The thing that put me on the side of Russia was remembering the Cuban missile crisis. We couldn't stand to have Russian missiles on our border so why should Russia be happy to be ringed by our missiles! It came out later that the only thing that kept nuclear missiles from being launched on Washington was a Russian submarine commander disobeying his orders!

It appeared to me that Russia was being backed into a corner that could only lead to conflict or surrender. Well, now, Russia has been shown to be no pushover.

The thing that ended the Cuban missile crisis wasn't us being tougher than the Russians but our agreement to take our missiles that were threatening Russia out of Turkey when they took theirs out of Cuba.

Of course in those days we had a statesman and a leader running the country. We don't have that now.
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PostPost by: h20hamelan » Wed Feb 22, 2023 9:03 pm

If Russia knows the end of Western trade is near, and China is a better alliance for trade.
Stands to reason Russia could have done the deed, this is the problem with everything.

Fact check away, money rules the earth.
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Thu Feb 23, 2023 10:04 am

Hi Kurt
Your issue seems to reflect 2 aspects of the war and why the West is at fault for it and Russia justified in its invasion.

1. Blowing up the Nordstream pipleline - this happened well after the beginning of the Feb 22 invasion so it cannot be a reason for the war. This is still no real published evidence of who did it and why. To say Russia had no reason to do it is stretching reality. Russia had been disrupting deliveries through other pipelines systematically to put pressure on Germany. There was potential for Nordstream 2 to be commissioned into operation to overcome these "technical problems" in the other pipelines. Blowing it up eliminated that potential in the short term supporting the on going Russian gas restrictions. I am not saying thats a fact but it is a reason that could have caused Russia to blow it up.

2. The Cuban missle crisis and the USA response 60 years ago is an excuse for the Russian invasion of Ukraine as Russian was similary being threated by the USA / Nato in 2022.

A few facts on the differences

1. The US did not invade Cuba but choose to impose a naval ban on shipments of missles and demand the silo destruction and withdrawal of nuclear capable bombers which the USSR ultimatley complied with.
2. ICBMs were in their invancy of deployment and Submarine launched nuclear missles were only in their trial stages in 1962. Intermediate range nuclear missles and air dropped nuclear bombs were the main deterent possessed byboth Russia and the USA. Postioning bombers and nuclear missles in Cuba as Russia was doing were a huge threat at the time and much greater than they would be today
3. An intermendiate range missle treaty existed in Europe from 1987. Russia commenced violations of that treaty in July 2014 ( interesting date) and Trump suspended compliance with the treaty in 2018 after years of Russian non compliance and Russia followed suit. If Russia had a legitimate reason for fearing nuclear weapons being positioned in Ukraine it should have complied with the treaty which banned it in Ukraine and the rest of Europe.
4. Regardless of the various treaties that Russia has violated under Putins rule including the securities guarrantees it gave when Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons, Ukraine was never going to be a Nato member while the various disputes with Russia over territory existed and the USA / Nato was never going to use the Ukraine as a staging post for nuclear weapons or for an invasion of Russia.

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PostPost by: 661 » Thu Feb 23, 2023 12:19 pm

UAB807F wrote:
rgh0 wrote:Are you looking for a general rebuttal of all the BS in that video or is there a specific element of BS you want me to address ?


:)

I'm no fan of Harris but in this case she's got a more sensible viewpoint than the expert who seems to think that Russia just wants it all to end.



Is that the same expert who in the video says that there is no evidence that Russia committed war crimes in 90% of the cases cited?
Well that's OK then. What a buffoon
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