Lotus Elan

Misbehaving Weber?

PostPost by: rgh0 » Mon Aug 01, 2016 10:58 am

I have just ordered an Innovate LM2 kit. I am planning to do some more playing with Carbs between dyno sessions which are getting to expensive to do often except when i do a major new specification engine build.

For positioning the sensor in an Elan tail pipe there are really only two options if you have headers.
i.e.
Just after the Y Piece at the front of the tail pipe and just before the rear muffler at the rear. These are the only locations where you will not wipe out the sensor on a speed bump when its installed and where you can position it to be self draining of any condensate.

I dont think there is much difference in terms of temperature at the two locations in normal road use and the sensor and the electronics adjust for temperature within the normal range experienced in an exhaust pipe.

The sensors can handle high temperatures as they are normally installed ahead of cat converters. They can also handle low temperatures as they are heated to work on startup. You just need to orient them so they are above the 3 to 9 o'clock position on the pipe to be self draining of any condensate that may form.

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PostPost by: john.p.clegg » Mon Aug 01, 2016 2:57 pm

Rohan
Y pieces are the most expendable,easy to remove to fit a boss,I fitted mine there,as you can just see in the piccy....

2015_10135spdexhaust0005.jpg and


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PostPost by: elanman999 » Mon Aug 01, 2016 4:41 pm

I've got my Lambda probe mounted about 70mm back from the GB filler plug (4 speed) on the drivers side (UK). It's at about 2 o'clock pointing slightly downwards and the lead is fed up the baulkhead and into the car to the controller.
It's worked OK for about 3 years now.
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John

Edit, sorry should have said "70mm back from GB drain plug"
Last edited by elanman999 on Mon Aug 01, 2016 6:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPost by: john.p.clegg » Mon Aug 01, 2016 4:55 pm

Seeing you are in Aussie,why LM2 and not WBO2 ?

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PostPost by: mbell » Mon Aug 01, 2016 5:37 pm

Ian T wrote:I think my next steps are to get the colourtune plugs out and have a look at cylinders 3 and 4 to see whether I can clean no4 up by adjustment, then perhaps go out for a longer drive to see if that helps clean it up.


Sounds like you're good making progress. Well worth looking at the colour tune, I think the common wisdom is it better to run the Twincam on the richer side for idle. Normally helps with off progression issues. Of course you should experiment and find you're own sweet spot for the car. Just don't be too concerned with a slightly rich idle.

The no4 cylinder gets most of the crank case blow by gases so its not uncommon for it to have a darker plug from the oil and other fumes being burnt in there. I'd give it a good run and see if it improves, maybe check the compression on the engine make sure its good.
'73 +2 130/5 RHD, now on the road and very slowly rolling though a "restoration"
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PostPost by: prezoom » Tue Aug 02, 2016 1:08 am

I have given some thought about the routing of the engine breather from the back of the air box back plate to a point somewhere in front of the air box, closer to the air filter. It seems to me, this would distribute the oil laden air more evenly to all four cylinders, rather than having it so close to the intake for the number four cylinder.
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PostPost by: Ian T » Tue Aug 02, 2016 7:14 am

I will reply properly later, but thanks folks for the replies.

An unscientific test for blowby gases found no evidence of any. There's no oily residue inside the airbox near the breather and I can't feel any gas exiting the pipe with the engine idling. I realise I'd need to repeat that test with the engine accelerating under load, but for now I'm hoping that I have good compression.

I am away for this week but will get on and do a warm compression test when I get back. Fingers crossed I don't find anything untoward there as the dodgy running was a problem for a while before I acquired the car (a few hundred miles) and so I am going to hope it isn't significantly bore washed.

I will report back. :)

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PostPost by: seniorchristo » Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:36 pm

I was able to mostly eliminate a large flat spot I had from 1000-2500 mostly by locking down the auxiliary venturies. The velocity stacks were not holding the AV's tight for a couple reasons. First the stacks were hitting the gasket which eventually I eliminated and also the hold down ears were not bent properly to secure everything. Whereas initially the AV's moved fore and aft 1/4" they are now solid. Thanks to Bill308 and Tim Marx for helping! :)
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PostPost by: Grizzly » Thu Aug 04, 2016 7:09 pm

If you still have the Mechanical fuel pump make sure the valves are properly sealing, i used my +2 every day for years and it ran great but now it's stood for months at a time it gets white build up from the dodgy modern fuel which gives me fuel starvation when driving. Also i bought a cheap Ultrasonic cleaner and i remove all the jets etc and put them in that for an hour or so before i adjust anything (usually just the white build up causing the jet to clog up)
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Fri Aug 05, 2016 10:22 am

john.p.clegg wrote:Seeing you are in Aussie,why LM2 and not WBO2 ?

John :wink:


Hi John
I had a look at the WBO2 and decided it was only a little cheaper and lacked the product maturity and flexibility of the LM2 so i went with the LM2. In particular the ability to easily log test runs on the road directly with just the LM2 onto a SD card was attractive.

It arrived today - 4 days after ordering - I wish I could get parts for some of the very expensive machines from large multinational manufacturers I operate as quick. Now to weld the bung on my Elans Exhaust and start playing

I like the slogan that Innovate Motorsports have on the box

"Knowledge is Horsepower" :D

cheers
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PostPost by: vstibbard » Sat Aug 06, 2016 4:05 am

HI Rohan, I'd be interested in how you find it, asI'm intending purchasing the dual set up so i can use it on the LTC's, Porsche, VW and 308 I have as all have higher compressions etc, with fuels what they are today felt it was the most economic and also best way to observe behaviour in real driving conditions

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PostPost by: Ian T » Sat Aug 06, 2016 9:13 am

I'm on the verge of buying the cheaper one, because I can make my own logger.

Essentially I only need the AFR function, but I want to find a way of fiting it that doesn't result in me modifying my car.

A difficult one perhaps - the manuals online suggest the sensor should be about 1-2m back from the exhaust valves. I have read that the sensor can be placed much further back by using a longer boss to take it slightly out of the exhaust gas flow, which means that a 'reasonably ok' installation on the Plus 2 might be with the boss welded in in front of the rear 'silencer'.

What I was looking for though, was a method of using it without drilling into the exhaust at all. I'm pretty familiar with waiting for my Crypton gas analyser to respond, so the question is, is it practical to make something to attach to the exhaust temporarily, or should I just bite the bullet and weld it in and replace with a bung?

Obviously (?) It seems like I have better than 95% solved my running fault by other measures above and the colortune plug might get me the rest of the way, so this is something I'd like to be able to use on all my cars, one of which does have a turbo.

Any ideas?

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PostPost by: Ian T » Sat Aug 06, 2016 9:15 am

seniorchristo wrote:I was able to mostly eliminate a large flat spot I had from 1000-2500 mostly by locking down the auxiliary venturies. The velocity stacks were not holding the AV's tight for a couple reasons. First the stacks were hitting the gasket which eventually I eliminated and also the hold down ears were not bent properly to secure everything. Whereas initially the AV's moved fore and aft 1/4" they are now solid. Thanks to Bill308 and Tim Marx for helping! :)


Thanks for the hint - I checked mine and they don't move, so there's something I can remove from the list. :)
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PostPost by: Ian T » Sat Aug 06, 2016 9:26 am

Grizzly wrote:If you still have the Mechanical fuel pump make sure the valves are properly sealing, i used my +2 every day for years and it ran great but now it's stood for months at a time it gets white build up from the dodgy modern fuel which gives me fuel starvation when driving. Also i bought a cheap Ultrasonic cleaner and i remove all the jets etc and put them in that for an hour or so before i adjust anything (usually just the white build up causing the jet to clog up)


Now that's an interesting point - I've not had the pump apart but it seems to be behaving itself with the reset float levels and different jets.

I think you are on to something with the deposits though - mine had some scale-like deposits on them and hence I used the Cillit Bang to clean them out. I didn't think of the ultrasonic cleaner even though I cleaned some Lotus M100 Elan injectors out a couple of years ago very successfully with one. I borrowed that, so I reckon it is time I bought my own and gave that a try as they aren't expensive these days. Good hint - I hadn't considered it affecting the fuel pump even though a previous car was a 1947 Vauxhall 10 with a very similar pump made by AC.

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PostPost by: john.p.clegg » Sat Aug 06, 2016 10:11 am

Looks like this thread has drifted and needs splitting into two ......

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