Separating the block from the bellhousing for engine pull

[kroseelan]

There are lots of good threads on pulling the engine & gearbox. I've just removed the six bolts I think attach the block to the bell housing, since I'm planning on leaving the gearbox in place for now. The engine is free from the engine mounts, I think all the other workshop manual steps are accounted for (carbs off, radiator removed, starter motor out, exhaust manifold disconnected...) The gearbox is supported on a jack, the engine on a hoist. Much to my surprise, the block doesn't show any signs of separating from the bell housing so I can just hoist the engine forward and up.

Are there more than the six bolts? Is it possible I've that the alignment between engine and gearbox is holding the engine in place?

Suggestions appreciated.

--Kevin
'72 Elan DHC, Federal model with Strombergs

[rgh0]

There are a couple of hollow dowels through which 2 of the lower bolts that join the block and bell housing go. They are there to ensure alignment of the block and bell housing. These are a push fit into the block and bellhousing and you generally need to get a screw driver in to lever them apart once all the bolts are out.

You need to pull the engine forward off the bell housing while keeping it aligned otherwise these hollow dowells and the gearbox input shaft will hang up and make the separation difficult.

cheers
Rohan

[robertverhey]

And there's 2-3 smaller bolts around the lower perimeter (including one above he slave cylinder that I sometimes overlook). Once these are out I usually wedge the box and engine apart with two large screwdrivers one on each side,, making sure it goes back parallel as rohan suggests, without putting too much strain on the gearbox input shaft/clutch

Robert

[AHM]

Make sure that you don't have a bending moment due to the angle of the hoist.

Slip a couple of bolts back in loosely, then raise/lower hoist/jack until you detect movement then give it a pull and a shake!

You have to slide the clutch off the input shaft so it isn't going to go easily, but I've never needed to lever anything.

[vernon.taylor]

Salut

I guess that means getting it back in will be very tricky ?

Searching for knowledge and wondering about doing a gearbox swap myself.

@+

Vernon

[robertverhey]

Nah, clutch aligning tools are readily available (in Oz, anyway) or I use an old input shaft

[rgh0]

Easy to refit engine onto gearbox in situ

Just make sure clutch is aligned with an aligning tool when refitting the clutch to the flywheel.

Then offer up the engine to the gearbox. Keep the flange gap constant around the bell housing as you bring the engine back to the gearbox.

A bit of shaking will normally get the gear box input shaft to go into the clutch ok and the dowels to initially seat
You should then have it to within about 10mm of mating up so put in the bolts and use them to pull it home fully seating the dowels in place.

I always do it this way as I find it much easier than pulling the engine and gearbox as a single unit.

cheers
Rohan

[vernon.taylor]

Merci Robert et Rohan - I was hoping that would be the answer

@+

Vernon

[Alasdair]

For those who sit at lights with clutch depressed like a lot of folks including a mate of mine, we had a terrible time separating engine from gearbox in an Elan as the pilot bearing was seized to input shaft!

He did not learn his lesson as he still does it.

[robertverhey]

Isn't pilot bearing in constant contact with input shaft irrespective of clutch being in or out?

[oldelanman]

Isn't pilot bearing in constant contact with input shaft irrespective of clutch being in or out?

Yes.....but the input shaft only rotates in the bearing when the clutch is disengaged (or slipping)

[robertverhey]

Still struggling a bit with this.

With clutch pedal depressed (clutch disengaged), gearbox input shaft stops turning, so (running) engine/flywheel/pilot bearing continues rotating relative to it.

With clutch pedal released (clutch engaged), whole shebang, engine, flywheel, pilot bearing and gearbox input shaft turn as one unit.

Given that he first scenario involves relative movement between the two components involved (pilot bearing and input shaft), I can't fathom why holding clutch pedal in would increase chances of seizing......maybe I'm missing something.

[oldelanman]

I can't see it either, premature bearing failure seems more likely than siezure....maybe Alasdair will be along in a minute to explain.

[AHM]

Given that he first scenario involves relative movement between the two components involved (pilot bearing and input shaft), I can't fathom why holding clutch pedal in would increase chances of seizing......maybe I'm missing something.

If the bearing didn't rotate it would be difficult for it to seize.

Friction in the bearing gets so great that the mating surfaces melt and weld them selves to each other, after that it doesn't work as intended, and can be a little difficult to remove.

[brettengelaz]

After having my engine out several times, I built a sling for the transmission that allows me to move the car while removing the engine. I used a length of square tubing, two threaded "eye" bolts, and some wire rope. The threaded eye-bolts lets you adjust the angle of the transmission and move the car if needed.. Loop the wire rope around the bellhousing just behind the mating surface, make sure to route it under the clutch slave, then tie off to each eye-bolt.

Correct clutch alignment is critical, beg, buy or borrow the tool when you're ready to assemble the clutch/pressure plate. I also made up some temporary alignment dowels for the engine/transmission from some hardware store threaded rod cut to about 3 inches long. They allow me to get the two rough aligned and the input shaft engaged without a lot of work. I put them in the four threaded holes in the bellhousing, slide the engine over them and then install the top two bolts from the bellhousing side into the engine. Then replace the guide dowels with bolts one at at time. (I ground flats on the ends so I can use a wrench to remove them, but, ViceGrips work just as well ....) I'm not near the car this weekend, but can post pictures on Tuesday if that will help..

Cheers,
Brett