Radiators and cooling

[pereirac]

My Sprint is running a bit hotter than I like (much like a lot of other Elan users). I have a standard radiator (the small triumph unit) and the original electric fan (no cowling or anything).

My local Triumph specialist has some new 3 core, full width radiators for around ?100.

Does anybody know of any reason why, if I bought one of these and had the top hose connector repositioned (a soft soldering job) it would not fit in my Elan (has anybody tried this)? With regards to fans, I assume a modern shrouded electric fan which clips onto the radiator would be better than the original 'open type'?

Any thoughts or suggestions welcome.

Thanks

Carl

[rgh0]

Carl

The modern shrouded fans are much more effective than the original free standing electric fans or engine driven fans. I have standard small triumph radiators recored with 3 rows in both my Plus2S 130/5 and in my 170 plus hp Elan with shrouded fans. Both were originally UK delivered cars privately imported to Australia. 40 plus degree C days in traffic in the plus 2 or flat out on the track in the Elan present no problems ( though the Elan cooling system is running right at its limit in these conditions on the track).

The original 2 core small radiator works fine in most Northern European conditions if everything else is OK. In Australia I believe all locally delivered cars came with the wider radiator as standard even the later models that had the small radiator in the UK. In hot climates with ambient temperatures over 35 C regularly in summer a 3 row recorded small radiator or the standard wider radiator is a wise change IMHO.

regards
Rohan

[stuartgb100]

Carl,

This is my first summer with a revised radiator setup in my Sprint, and so far all is fine.

Over the winter I picked up an original full-width radiator on ebay and had it recored (with an extra row added at the same time). I didn't have to change either top or bottom hose.

I've fitted a 72 degree thermostat and a 9 inch Kenlowe fan. The Kenlowe cuts in at 190 degrees F, and drops the temperature to approx 184 pdq.

Under driving conditions (in the recent 30 degree C heat) the temperature was never above 175 / 180. When sitting in traffic the temp slowly climbs to 190, and the fan promptly cuts in. When on the move again, the natural airflow through the rad soon drops it back to the 175/180 level.

I use a cardboard infill piece between the steering rack and the bottom of the rad to force air through the rad.

I have not infilled between top of rad and u/s of bonnet. Do not need to.
Plus, I want to duct cool air through to the exhaust manifold area.

I will probably change to a hotter thermostat for winter use. I use a 10psi rad cap (don't forget that one school of thought recommends changing the rad cap every year - it loses its' pressure rating).

All in all I'm very pleased. Last summer's problems seem a long way away. Well, as far as overheating is concerned, anyway.

Regards,
Stuart.

[john-c-elan+2]

Carl, I did just that (mine is a late +2 s130) fitted the wide triumph rad and cured any tendancy for the lump to get too warm. Make sure the rad you have seen has the filler cap to offside as some have it in centre and might foul bonnet. I used a kenlow fan & controller. This does away with that leaky otter switch seal & the fusewire to hold it in. I had to taper the brackets on both rad sides a little to get it to slide in - easy job with a coarse file. But fit it does ! Even when it was as hot as it was on Monday
it didn't get past 85 degrees !

[Hamish Coutts]

Just to add my contribution guys,

Just back (about an hour ago) from a great few days on Arran, in the Firth of Clyde. OK, I know it's Scotland but the temps were about 28degC for all 5 days . Trouble is my re-cored rad, which was re-cored with a Triumph 2.5 pi core, was NOT up to the job. The car didn't boil but was damned close a couple of times on some of the climbs, which were around 800 to 1400ft on narrow roads . In short, the rad couldn't cut it.

Coming back home through Glasgow today we got stuck in a couple of traffic queues. Almost immediately the fan cut in (90 degC, air temp was 23degC) and stayed on 'till we were on the move again for about 10 mins. That, to me, is on the limits. I have an 82deg thermostat fitted. I find the 72 degree one too cold in normal conditions. (In the frozen North we need a little heat coming out of the heaters)

I will most certainly be going for a full width rad this coming winter maintenance period and I am really interested in what you guys opinions are about them.

(I'll also be checking where all the rattles came from when on the bumby roads ). God, some of the roads were as rough as a badger's whatsit. Grounded the exhaust a few times on ridges in the middle of the road - and it was a two lane road!! That said, I would go back tomorrow.

Hamish.

[stuartgb100]

Hamish,

Just a thought:

If you're major upgrading this winter (rad etc), what about a short-term experiment?

When did you last change the rad cap? Why not try a new one? If there's no improvement, then so be it (but you'll have a new one ready for the winter works).

Regards,
Stuart.

[mark030358]

I have just bought and fitted one of the full width aluminium radiators that are for sale on ebay. Not the cheapest, but a perfect fit, a quality core and EXCELLENT after sales service. The first one sent to me was crushed by the GPO in transit, when I rang the suppliers they sent me a new one out same day and collected the damaged one. FIRST CLASS SERVICE. I have not as yet thrashed the car in anger but I will report back with the results. My origional small radiator, even though recored with 3 rows, would hold the temp at 90ish in the recent hot weather, too close for comfort for me.

Cheers
Mark
72 Sprint

[M100]

Coming back home through Glasgow today we got stuck in a couple of traffic queues. Almost immediately the fan cut in (90 degC, air temp was 23degC) and stayed on 'till we were on the move again for about 10 mins. That, to me, is on the limits

There is no other way for the heat to dissipate when stuck in traffic, the fan will run non stop. You could maybe fit a more efficient fan and shroud the fan blades which would reduce the fan run time in static conditions but your radiator is probably oversized if it was capable of cooling the 2.5 Triumph.

I agree with what Stuart said, get someone to check your radiator cap to see what pressure it holds or just replace it.

I try to avoid traffic in my Elan (still on the standard narrow radiator and original electric fan) it runs most of the time in the mid to high 80's on everything from flat out on the motorway to climbing hills in the Yorkshire Dales. It might occasionally and very briefly creep up to mid 90's but no more than that.

[steveww]

There is no other way for the heat to dissipate when stuck in traffic, the fan will run non stop.

With a big radiator and a modern 10" electric fan fitted to my S4 the fan will come on in traffic and pull the temp down enough to turn the fan off. Repeated as required

[Hamish Coutts]

When did you last change the rad cap? Why not try a new one?

Stuart,

Must admit, I've never fitted a new rad cap. I got a couple of caps with the car when I bought it and they always seemed to work properly.

Will give it a go.

Thanks all for the comments. Think I'll probably try a better fan for this year and see how it goes. Hopefully we'll get some more hot weather to try it out!

I'll watch the full width rad discussions with interest.

Hamish.

[pereirac]

I was beginning to wonder what size of electric fan fits

So 10" is enough?

Thanks

Carl

[John Larkin]

I fitted a re-built radiator (narrow one) with three rows, an electric fan and an electric water pump to my 1968 S3 Elan last year, and all of my cooling problems were wiped out. I am still fascinated that the car does not boil in heavy traffic, and I am now not afraid to drive it around Dublin (probably among the worst traffic congestion in Europe).

[ianf]

All,

I am really interested in this as well. I have a standard ancient rad with an almost equally ancient shrouded kenlowe and have to leave the heater valve open all the time. I have just about settled on a TTR alloy rad but I think a full width Triumph item would look better in an otherwise standard car (as well as saving about ?400!). I'm not going to do it this year but would be really interested in the outcome of this thread.

My objective is sub 85 degrees with the heater off - I'm not bothered if the fan is running or not - thats what they are there for.

Cheers,

Ian

[stuartgb100]

Just a point for clarity:

As Steve said, under moving conditions the Kenlowe seems not to be required ( the airflow in 30 degree heat is comfortably dealt with by the big re-cored rad).

When stuck in traffic etc, temperature rises. When it hits the adjustable preset temp, the Kenlowe cuts in. If set correctly, the Kenlowe will drop the temp by 5-10 degrees within 2 mins, then cut off.

The fan does not run continuously, therefore.

A point on costs:

My full-width rad was ?60 on ebay including postage. A rebuild + an extra row of cores was ?70 + vat. No need to change top or bottom outlets. No need to change hoses. No need to worry about revised mounting points.

If you're after this rad, it should be cheaper via a Triumph outlet or Triumph ebay site (some say the full-width rad was Herald sourced) .... some dispute.

The much-offered aluminium rad is approx ?300 before you add delivery and Vat, plus the necessary modifications.

I prefer something much closer to the original (and being half Scottish, having spent some money on a cheaper solution, find myself with a smile on my face......vbg!).

As regards the rad cap (and please kill me here!):

My understanding is that the cap's pressure rating deteriorates with a combination of time and/or usage.

The original rating determines how much the pressurised system can allow the coolant to run above boiling point.

If the cap deteriorates, then the system is running at a lower value.

It could still appear that all is well, .......... until (vbg) !!!.

HTH.

Regards,
Stuart.

[elansprint71]

TT 26r rad recently fitted to my Sprint.
Normal running temp about 75 degrees. Fan cuts in at 90 degrees, drops out at 80 degrees.

Brilliant!

Cheers,
Pete.