1966 elan S2–oil pan questions

[SteveK]

I’ve started tinkering with my S2 after it sat on the shelf for about 4 years. I bought it locally and it had not run for about 6 years when I found it. Got it running but not well so that’s why it went on the shelf. About a month ago I started working on it again; installed 2 new Webers and fixed a few small items and she’s running great except for the oil leak. I have a lift and the car has the removable cross brace so I thought a new gasket set would be easy (famous last words). Very easy to pull the starter, remove the cross brace and torsion bar and remove all 18 pan bolts. The cork gasket was completely saturated so no big issue breaking the pan free, but now I’m finding it misses coming out by about 1/4”. Searched to forums and see that I may need a split bell housing cover to pull the pan?, or am I missing something simple? I really don’t want to pull the motor for an oil leak so I’m looking for what others have done. I do have room to clean up the cork gasket surface but it looks like it’s virtually impossible to do anything with the rope seals? Would really appreciate any good or bad experience anyone has!

Thanks in advance!

Steve

[Craven]

With an early engine ( MK1) the bell housing cover is in one piece and can’t be removed. If your oil leak is from the rear rope crank seal then it’s engine out, replacing this seal and get it leak free is almost impossible even with the engine on the bench. Lots of info on this site on later types of seal material.

[englishmaninwales]

With an early engine ( MK1) the bell housing cover is in one piece and can’t be removed. If your oil leak is from the rear rope crank seal then it’s engine out, replacing this seal and get it leak free is almost impossible even with the engine on the bench. Lots of info on this site on later types of seal material.

+1
I gave up trying to make the early rope seal leak free (and certainly don’t waste your time unless the engine is out and on the stand) and I fitted a 6 bolt crank/flywheel/sump/seal carrier and lip seal (thank you Nick Stagg for supply). This is a far better engineered arrangement, but still requires care to fit the seal/carrier centrally and care with the sump cork gasket.

Malcolm

[Mazzini]

+1 to what Craven wrote.

You can undo the bell housing bolts and pull the engine forward a few inches and that will allow you to drop the sump, but is it worth it as the crank rope seal is in two pieces and dropping the sump only allows you to work on the lower seal. Might as well do the job properly and pull the engine.

I had been using a GraphTite Pontiac seal, but it seems that that had started to rotate in the housing. I've fitted them previously and with good effect, this is the first time that I've had one fail.

I recently found a rope seal to lip seal conversion. The rope seal carrier that attaches to the block is modified to carry an alloy ring that holds a lip seal, the seal runs on the narrow crank boss where the flywheel attaches. The only drawback is that this system requires a later lip seal / Mk 2 sump - which are rare and expensive.

[Quart Meg Miles]

Welcome to Eland, Steve, looks like a nicely finished car you've got and original looking from what I see; I'll forgive the Minilites!

Craven is right, I've failed to suppress leakage from the rear rope seals for fifty years though my last attempt lasted a couple. The proper ropes aren't available (in the UK anyway) but a recent post suggested a 1970s Toyota Corolla part did. But it's not possible to change them without the engine out, so seal the sump and be lucky.

[RichardHawkins]

Steve,

There is a man in California called Keith Franck who runs a web site vintagetechnologygarage. He has been working on this problem of an oil tight rope seal for years, and thinks he is there. Might be worth contacting Keith.

Personally I would try to find the parts to change to a lip seal. As for changing the gasket from underneath its very difficult. When you get the pressed steel sump off check for flatness and distortion. The surface of the block also need to be clean so that the gasket dressing will stick. Difficult enough with the engine on a stand.

Richard Hawkins

[Barney]

Not being an engineer at all, I try to embrace the self-lubricating chassis feature of the car.

[SteveK]

Thanks everyone for the comments! It also looks like I can remove the motor mount bolts and lower the engine an inch or so to remove the pan but why do that or split the bell if it’s going to leak anyway? Guess I’ll be living with an oil pan under the car for a while until I investigate the higher tech solutions and pull the engine. I have all of the gasket material removed and have cleaned the surfaces with both degreaser and then starting fluid. Also checked for flatness with my straightedge and it all looks pretty good. Also made some dowels for re-assembly. Now the question is the best gasket dressing for holding the cork in place while I push the pan up. Seems like the forums are all over the place so I’d be interested in any comments. I do have aviation form a gasket and permatex blue but I suspect their not sticky enough.

Steve

[Quart Meg Miles]

. The proper ropes aren't available (in the UK anyway) but a recent post suggested a 1970s Toyota Corolla part did.

Oops, that suggestion was about the air-box gasket, very sorry!

[joe7]

Rather than putting the pan gasket on the block try putting the gasket on the pan. Use AV gasket stuff let it sit put pan on. BTW this makes it much easier to clean the old gasket off the pan rather than off the bottom of the block.