dfifferent distributors

[tonyabacus]

Does anyone have the measurements for the Lucas 23D4 and 45D4 distributors.

I note that both were fitted to the twin cam, but wondered what the overall length is including distributor cap. Getting at the cap appears to be easier with the 23D4 so why did Lotus make the change from one to the other, and is one slightly longer than the other in total length including the gear, or is body slightly different in lengthe?
Tony

[richardcox_lotus]

Tony, in service I think they were always 23’s and only after production ended, and 45s were the then ‘current’ Lucas offering, were switchovers made. Yes, the 45s are taller and more awkward but I no longer have a 23 to compare.

Regards
Richard

[vstibbard]

The 25’s were Lotus replacement parts only, in early 80’s when restoring my first Elan, Len St supplied one to me.
In Australia a common conversion uses the Bosch distributor used on pinto’s, I think there some basic machining required to reduce the length. This distributor has better bearings and advance mechanism. Range of top and side entry caps are available.
I use these in race engines with roller bearings fitted.
From memory the company in Melbourne is Performance Ignitions, Rohan may have more information to add.
Vaughan

[rgh0]

The Australian assembled 70's Escorts used a Bosch distributor which was a straight drop in replacement after changing the advance curve and fitting a side entry cap and deleting the vacuum advance. Igniton Developments supplied racing versions either using the original case or a billet case with roller bearings fitted. Unfortunately the guy running the company retired many years ago and it has shutdown. You could fit 911S points to the distributor and it was good for 9000 rpm plus. You cant get the original 911S points new these days but new old stock comes up on Ebay from time to time. The GB700 points are the same except for a weaker spring and these are still available so its possible to modify these and fit the stronger spring from the 911S ones

cheers
Rohan

[2cams70]

I've never come across an Australian Escort fitted at the factory with a Bosch distributor. They were all fitted with either Autolite (Ford's own brand) or locally manufactured Lucas distributors. The Bosch so called 009 distributor was fitted by Ford to Kent series engines in the UK when it was installed in early front wheel drive Fiestas. So if you are in the UK and can find a scrap Kent series engined Mk1 Fiesta you may be in luck. I'm not sure about the situation in the USA. Early Fiesta were never imported by Ford to Australia. We had the Mazda based Ford Laser instead. The Pinto OHC series Ford engine is something totally different and nothing out of that will fit a Kent block series engine (i.e the engine family we all know and love which includes the LTC).

[rgh0]

I was told by Ignition Developments when i bought them back in the 80's it was sourced from Kent engined Escorts, Maybe he was buying them out of UK or Germany if they were not fitted in Australia. You can still buy them on places like Autodoc in the UK

BOSCH 0 986 237 006 Ignition distributor FORD ESCORT, CAPRI

https://www.autodoc.parts/bosch/7290385


cheers
Rohan

[vstibbard]

Rohan, I thought they were pinto units, Kent makes more sense. I’ve two of his roller bearing distributors.
I’ve used Bosch distributors that were sourced from street cleaning machines here in Sydney that had ford engines fitted.
V

[alanr]

I have in the past used a modified Mk1 Fiesta (Kent)Bosch distributor in FF1600 here in the UK in preference to the Lucas distributor. I still have a spare modified Bosch unit left over from those days so may just try in my +2 sometime when I have time.
I just wonder though can someone tell me is there sufficient clearance for a Bosch side entry cap, which is much bulkier than a Lucas side entry cap, under the inlet manifold of a Twink?

Alan.

[2cams70]

Rohan, I thought they were pinto units, Kent makes more sense. I’ve two of his roller bearing distributors.
I’ve used Bosch distributors that were sourced from street cleaning machines here in Sydney that had ford engines fitted.
V

Yes it’s true that the Bosch distributor was also fitted to Kent VSG series industrial engines. I’ve got a Kent engine out of a Bobcat that has one fitted.

[tonyabacus]

Alan
I can confirm that my twincam recently built by JS Motorsort in the UK does have a Lucas 45D4 distributor with side entry cap fitted. This is what gave rise to my original question about the heights of the 23D4 and the 45D4. Room between the top of the side entry cap and the carbs is quite tight although you can get the cap off providing it is held on with clips rather than screws.

I would imagine it is pretty much impossible to remove the laft hand screw in situ and would need the distributor removing to get the screw out. Because the clips can get distorted I have taken the precaution of using a tie wraps around the clips and cap to ensure it stays in the correct position to the rotor arm.

However I am still left wondering whether the total length of the two distributors with respective caps in place are different. I think some time ago I read that Lotus had to revert to the 45D4 when the original 23D4 became obsolete, which was around 1970ish?

So if anyone has both distributors and could take a measurement that would be useful and thanks to all who have contributed so far.
Tony

[alanr]

Hi Tony,
Yes I realise with the Lucas distributor there is enough clearance.

My question was if anyone knew if a Bosch distributor (ex-Kent engine Mk1 Fiesta type which I and many others used when racing in Formula Ford1600) would have sufficient clearance under the inlet manifold of a twincam?
It would need a side entry distributor cap and the Bosch side entry cap is much larger than the Lucas equivalent.

This thread has sparked my interest to try a Bosch distributor that I have (better advance curve) than the Lucas original) in my +2.

Alan

[elanman999]

Tony, I had a 45d with a side entry cap but the cap had been modified to use with clips. It just had a V groove filed across where the screws had been, to give the clips somewhere to hold on to.
Cheers
John.

[rgh0]

Photo of my spare modified Bosch distributor versus the original 23D. The Bosch is 220mm from the mounting fange in the block to top of the cap with a side entry cap of 60mm high. The original is 235mm from the block mounting flange to the top of the side entry cap.

The Bosch cap does not have a part number unfortunately

cheers
Rohan

[rgh0]

Performance Ignition here in Melbourne also make a "Scorcher" distributor based on the same Bosch body with the same side entry cap as i got from Ignition Developments back in the late 80's. The one they advertise is electronic but I presume they could make you a points based one if your racing class required that.

https://performanceignition.com.au/products/ol7zaaruqw

cheers
Rohan

[alanr]

Photo of my spare modified Bosch distributor versus the original 23D. The Bosch is 220mm from the mounting fange in the block to top of the cap with a side entry cap of 60mm high. The original is 235mm from the block mounting flange to the top of the side entry cap.

The Bosch cap does not have a part number unfortunately

Bosch and Lucas Dizzys.jpg

cheers
Rohan

Thanks for that information Rohan,
Looks like my concern over the Bosch side entry cap height and the twink inlet manifiold was unfounded. I will now do a bit of Googling for an appropriate cap to match the distributor I have. I can then when time prevails have a play around with the spare modified Bosch distributor I have (ex- Kent engine) in my +2 and see how it goes.

Much appreciated,

Alan.

Edit: Apologies Tony for jumping in on your original post thread!