4 speed bellhousing

[tonyabacus]

Again for clarity, so the only bell housings for an Elan are the Anglia, Mexico, RS1600, Twincam Escort. Is it possible for the later mk2 twincam bell housing to fit?

Can any of the other bellhousings be ground out inside to fit and if so has anyone got pictures so people can see?
What difference does it make that the clutch slave cylinder mounting position is slightly different as noted above

[2cams70]

Mk2 Lotus Cortina is also the same. I'm not sure if the 105E bellhousing will still fit with clearance to the pressure plate if it isn't relieved. I'm sure it was relieved internally for Lotus application for some reason however.
I did post pictures of the relieving a few years ago somewhere on this forum. Not sure where to find it now.

[types26/36]

I did post pictures of the relieving a few years ago somewhere on this forum. Not sure where to find it now.

This thread?
viewtopic.php?t=38616&p=266883

[2cams70]

This thread?viewtopic.php?t=38616&p=266883

That's the one - thanks.

[tonyabacus]

2Cams
In your previous article you seem to be saying that the bellhousing removed from the Escort Twincam was a 105E casting number but listed as 3026E 7505A, is that correct?

Was the clutch in the Escort Twincam the same size as an Elan or the smaller diameter?

Given the amount of confusion and the variety of bellhousing out there, I think it would be useful if we can get a definitive table of which bellhousings fit the Elan, either straight out of the box or with some modification. Perhaps also a benefit to others if we can tell them which bellhousings are not suitable. So are you able to clarify the above as a starter?

[promotor]

That would be just great...thanks,

Alan.

Here you go - the Lotus clutch is stopping the bellhousing edge meeting the block face with a 120e bellhousing. The profile of the bellhousing is completely different to the 105e bellhousing (which I can't show as I'm limited on the number of photos I can post!). As far as I can tell to make one of these bellhousings fit the metal would have to be machined so much you might break through the casting, or weaken it so much it wouldn't be worth using it.

This thread?viewtopic.php?t=38616&p=266883

That's the one - thanks.

That machined bellhousing is not the rule here in the UK - I must have had 20 or so of these bellhousings (either mine or customers') - most have come from Elans, Mk1 Lotus Cortina and Mexico's etc and I don't recall seeing one with that machining. I'm confident that bellhousings taken from a 105e and fitted to an engine with the Lotus big clutch will fit.
I have checked a bellhousing that came from my friend's Elan - which he swapped when he fitted an aluminium bellhousing - and this doesn't have the machining, nor does it need it. I have marked where the ring gear comes to in the bellhousing, and also measured where the backface of the flywheel comes to - the back edge of the thick chalk line is where the flywheel clutch surface comes to if you were to extend it out beyond its extremity. The nearest thin chalk line in the shot is where the ring gear is at its nearest point to the engine.
Perhaps parts in Australia needed this for whatever reason, but it's not the rule here in UK from what I've seen. Possibly there are exceptions, but not from what I've seen.

(sorry about the quality of the photo, camera is playing up, but it shows what I wanted it to!)

I don't believe a Mk2 cortina bellhousing will fit as I think the starter motor housing / casting will foul the chassis in an Elan. In a Lotus Elan the starter motor bendix cover is flattened to fit the chassis. It is the same type of cover as a Lotus Cortina or Escort Twincam cover except for the flattening. A mk2 cortina bellhousing is completely different, was only used in the mk2 cortina (all cars - 1300, 1600, Lotus with small and big clutches) and uses its own clutch fork, release bearing, slave cylinder and pushrod. It is a self-adjusting system so is maintenance free in terms of clutch adjustment as it automatically adjusts as the clutch wears. It was a good design but was phased out as cable clutches arrived.
There may be some exhaust fitment issues also with a mk2 cortina bellhousing.

For joe7 who mentioned another bellhousing that fits I'm not sure which one you may be referring to, but it got me thinking about another bellhousing of mine that might fit - a 109e casting - and that gave the same fitment problems as the 120e above!

The 105e bellhousing is the one to use - even if for whatever reason it is found to need some relieving in the bottom as per 2cams photo - it is the best starting point for an Elan as they are proven to fit and came from the factory with a 105e bellhousing.
A 105e bellhousing will need the clutch pivot pin removing (and you wouldn't want to use the Anglia clutch fork either) and replaced with the Elan type fitting which is a straight fit.

[2cams70]

From the Ford Parts lists I have:

Mk1 Lotus Cortina (post '64): Bellhousing P/N 105E 7505B (i.e same as Anglia)
Mk1 Lotus Cortina (pre '64): Bellhousing P/N 28F / 704 (Lotus supply - assume this was aluminium)
Mk1 Escort Twin Cam: Bellhousing P/N 3020E 7500 C (no longer the same as Anglia - i.e now modified Anglia)

I don't have a parts listing for the Mk2 Lotus Cortina however 3020E is generally a P/N prefix associated with the MK2 Lotus Cortina.

A couple of points:

1. I mentioned the Mk2 Lotus Cortina bellhousing. Of course the standard Mk2 OHV bellhousing will not fit
2. The Mk1 Escort Mexico isn't really relevant to the discussion as it uses a smaller 7.5" clutch and pressure plate.
3. I suspect the internal relieving was introduced around the time of the six bolt crank introduction. There may have been an associated change to either the flywheel, ring gear or pressure plate profile requiring more internal clearance inside the bellhousing.

The Aussie Escort T/C's were all built using UK sourced powertrain parts. Nothing was localised.

[promotor]

From the Ford Parts lists I have:

Mk1 Lotus Cortina (post '64): Bellhousing P/N 105E 7505B (i.e same as Anglia)
Mk1 Lotus Cortina (pre '64): Bellhousing P/N 28F / 704 (Lotus supply - assume this was aluminium)
Mk1 Escort Twin Cam: Bellhousing P/N 3020E 7500 C (no longer the same as Anglia - i.e now modified Anglia)

A couple of points:

1. I mentioned the Mk2 Lotus Cortina bellhousing. Of course the standard Mk2 OHV bellhousing will not fit
2. The Mk1 Escort Mexico isn't really relevant to the discussion as it uses a smaller 7.5" clutch and pressure plate.
3. I suspect the internal relieving was introduced around the time of the six bolt crank introduction. There may have been an associated change to either the flywheel, ring gear or pressure plate profile requiring more internal clearance inside the bellhousing.

I'd like to see a mk1 escort twincam bellhousing with 3020e 7500c cast into it! I doubt you'll find one!
That part number - 3020e 7500 c - is listed in the Mk2 Cortina parts book for the bellhousing (to fit all mk2 cortinas) so I can tell you that some info somewhere as supplied Ford and Lotus is incorrect either on purpose or not! Here's where it gets more confusing - a mk2 cortina bellhousing has 3014e 7505a or 3034e 7505a cast in to it! I've seen enough of those too. All mk2 cortina bellhousings are the same whether 1300, 1600, or Lotus.

The photo above is with a 6 bolt crank and Lotus flywheel and clutch - it doesn't need the clearance machining to make it fit, there's quite a bit of room. The bellhousing came from a car with 6 bolt crank and proper Lotus clutch / flywheel.

I stand by what I say - the standard Anglia 105e bellhousing fits and came supplied originally in Lotus Elans.

[alanr]

Thanks very much for you efforts in checking a 120E bellhousing possible fitment for me !...Much appreciated and saved me a lot of grief buying one!

Alan.

[promotor]

Thanks very much for you efforts in checking a 120E bellhousing possible fitment for me !...Much appreciated and saved me a lot of grief buying one!

Alan.

You're welcome Alan. I needed to check some other gearbox related bits so I killed two birds with one stone.

[2cams70]

I'd like to see a mk1 escort twincam bellhousing with 3020e 7500c cast into it! I doubt you'll find one!

The part number on the casting is the casting part number and not necessarily the part number for the final part (i.e the part number on the engineering drawing). If the 105E part number subsequently undergoes additional machining the part number has to change otherwise you'd end up with two final parts in the system with the different specifications but having the same part number. Hence the machined Escort Twin Cam bellhousing has the same 105E casting number as the Anglia but not necessarily the same final part number

That part number - 3020e 7500 c - is listed in the Mk2 Cortina parts book for the bellhousing (to fit all mk2 cortinas) so I can tell you that some info somewhere as supplied Ford and Lotus is incorrect either on purpose or not!

Escort Twin Cam P/N: 3020 7500 C
Standard Mk2 OHV bellhousing P/N: 3020E 7500 A

You are correct though - sometimes there are mistakes in the parts listings!

[types26/36]

Here is the page from the Mk 2 Cortina parts list (including Lotus)
I have worked with a few of the bellhousings and my guide is, if the bellhousing has the strengthening ribs on the outside it will fit the Lotus clutch, I’m not saying it’s true but that rule has always worked for me

[2cams70]

Here is the page from the Mk 2 Cortina parts list (including Lotus)
I have worked with a few of the bellhousings and my guide is, if the bellhousing has the strengthening ribs on the outside it will fit the Lotus clutch, I’m not saying it’s true but that rule has always worked for me

Thanks for that. It seems the ribbed (i.e Anglia) bellhousing will fit without machining but I'm still intrigued as to why mine has been internally relieved. This is the second bellhousing I've seen like this. I've seen one other in the past on Ebay UK that also had the internal machining. By the looks of it it has been done properly at the factory and isn't something someone has done afterward. I do have another Escort TC lurking around but I haven't taken that one apart yet. Hopefully I'll get to it sometime before I die and see if that one is the same also!!

Maybe the relieving was done for the Escort RS1600 and The Australian Escort T/C's picked up what was used for them?

I'd be interested in what your Mk2 Cortina parts book lists as part numbers for both the standard and Lotus bellhousings. The Australian Mk2 Cortina parts book does not include the Lotus variant.

Interestingly the Australian Mk1 Cortina parts book does include the Lotus variant so perhaps for Australia the Lotus variant was planned for but unfortunately dropped late in the piece.

[types26/36]

I'd be interested in what your Mk2 Cortina parts book lists as part numbers for both the standard and Lotus bellhousings.

My book only shows one more bellhousing and that is for the Automatic, it only seems to show another component when it differentiates from the standard Cortina with a note at the bottom of the page noting it is for a GT or Lotus version (as per example)

[promotor]

I'd like to see a mk1 escort twincam bellhousing with 3020e 7500c cast into it! I doubt you'll find one!

The part number on the casting is the casting part number and not necessarily the part number for the final part (i.e the part number on the engineering drawing). If the 105E part number subsequently undergoes additional machining the part number has to change otherwise you'd end up with two final parts in the system with the different specifications but having the same part number. Hence the machined Escort Twin Cam bellhousing has the same 105E casting number as the Anglia but not necessarily the same final part number

That part number - 3020e 7500 c - is listed in the Mk2 Cortina parts book for the bellhousing (to fit all mk2 cortinas) so I can tell you that some info somewhere as supplied Ford and Lotus is incorrect either on purpose or not!

Escort Twin Cam P/N: 3020 7500 C
Standard Mk2 OHV bellhousing P/N: 3020E 7500 A

You are correct though - sometimes there are mistakes in the parts listings!

Mk2 Cortina parts book - notice that it is listing 3020e 7500 c to fit manual, floor change and automatic gearboxes, which is not possible! It's suggesting that the part number 3020e 7500 c is a generic term for a bellhousing!

That's why a mix of experience and info from a book is needed! I've given up completely believing everything the parts books tell me!