Lotus Elan

Elan Sprint Gear lever fitting gear lever cap snags chassis

PostPost by: Grizzly » Thu Oct 26, 2017 5:40 pm

MarkDa wrote:Mew plate may be needed if a new gaiter has been sourced as these seem to be a bit smaller than the originals for some reason.


Yep, that is the no1 reason the gear selector needs to be fairly centre of the trans tunnel if it's being assembled as factory (the bush in the anti sizzle selector is really tight in the newer style gaiters and doesn't have enough give in my opinion)

I agree with what you say about drilling the holes in the chassis, i noticed on mine how the horizontal holes are very centre of the weld on plates which means nearly every vertical hole has a spacer (a have a 15mm thick heat shield on the inside of my bonnet and it doesn't touch the cam cover with stock mounts)
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PostPost by: Grizzly » Thu Oct 26, 2017 5:42 pm

Bob, did you take any pictures of the gearbox in the chassis before the body went on? did the selector appear in the centre then?
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PostPost by: MarkDa » Thu Oct 26, 2017 9:06 pm

I had plenty of cam cover clearance, it was the front of the air box just where it morphs into a pipe that was catching.
I think that it had been doing it slightly when I first got the car but a new front end and chassis along with new mounts made it worse.
I got some rubbing and paint loss between the bonnet and aperture, which doesn't show normally.
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PostPost by: bloodknock » Wed Nov 01, 2017 9:11 am

Hi Chris
I took photographs as I built up the chassis with the engine block and gear box installed but unfortunately the gear lever aperture is not realy visible, should have taken a top shot!
I have cut up an old engine mount and am now going to try Cravens idea.
Regards
Bob
Attachments
gear-lever-chassis-alignment.jpg and
2013-06-19-engine-and-gearbox-in-chassis.jpg and
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PostPost by: bloodknock » Thu Nov 02, 2017 5:54 pm

OK, I now have the right hand (looking forwards) engine mount spaced with a cut off engine mount part, this appears to have gained me at most 1mm spacing of the gear lever cone, plus it has distorted the actual engine mount stretching and compressing the bonded rubber. I loosened the gear box mounting bolts to ensure that if there was any possibility of the assembly swivelling due to mounting tollerances it could.
So I dont think this is a solution to the problem.
Any other ideas folks?
regards
Bob
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Thu Nov 02, 2017 6:42 pm

I suppose the engine mounts are fitted on the correct sides. The mount on the carb side raises the engine higher which would move the gear lever away from the chassis rail.
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PostPost by: Craven » Thu Nov 02, 2017 7:30 pm

You could try fitting the same on the other side, the other side of the mounting of course.
If a slight twist in the rubber is unacceptable then this is not for you.
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PostPost by: MarkDa » Thu Nov 02, 2017 9:01 pm

Bob
So looking from front you need to rotate the engine/gearbox anti-clockwise?
When I wanted to do this to drop the airbox I elongated the engine side holes in the mount.
I didn't check how much the gearlever moved I'm afraid but it must have been a few mm.
However rather than random filing how about going back to basics?
Suspend the engine, disconnect the mounts and then rotate the whole unit until you get the right clearance on the gearlever and passenger footwell.
You can then see where the engine mounts need to be.
It may well be that you will get the rotation by using a RH mount on left without compromising footwell clearance as the lever effect is limited at that radius.
Your earlier photos on here don't have the resolution to see what it looked like on your first fit - any better for you?
I share your frustration, you're being very patient!
Mark.
Last edited by MarkDa on Fri Nov 03, 2017 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPost by: MarkDa » Thu Nov 02, 2017 9:29 pm

Bob
Are you absolutely sure that the LH mount is correct?
It may just be photo angles but it doesn't look to have enough 'lift'
Mark
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PostPost by: bloodknock » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:23 pm

Hi Mark,
thanks for your helpfull comments.
I have checked the following:
-The engine and gearbox are centred true in the chassis
-The engine mountings are correctly fitted on the appropriate side and are the correct type. (they are in fact new old mounts purchased in the early 80's)
-The gearbox spacers are 1/2 inch and in place
-The correct Spacers (1 3/16") are fitted to the exhaust side engine mount.
I can only think that the engine gbox assy has an excessive lean to the right (looking from the front) since the gear lever assy is within 1.5mm of the chassis on the passenger side. Now, im not sure which way the engine will torque turn on accelleration and decelleration, but im thinking that the 1.5mm clearance will result in thumping on the chassis.
Tomorrow i'll measure the exact clearance beneath the carb air box (I estimated 1.5 cm earlier)
You dont happen to know what the gap should be do you?
Cheers
Bob
Attachments
gearbox-exhaust-bracket-location.jpg and
2013-06-19-engine-mounts-in-place.jpg and
2013-06-19-engine-mounts-in-place-2.jpg and
engine-mount-spacer-ns.jpg and
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PostPost by: MarkDa » Sun Nov 05, 2017 11:13 pm

Bob
I'm afraid I don't know what the normal football clearance is. I only reduced mine because of the airbox pipe to bonnet return interference.
So far I haven't noticed a problem but the mounts are new and may yet settle!
I too will measure what I've got tomorrow and let you know.

It's really strange that with all the right bits you've got this rotation.
I expect you are right about knocking on the tunnel. Even if it doesn't you're still a long way from having a decent fit with the gearlever gaiter.

It may be worth undoing the exhaust mount, lifting that side a bit to see how far out it is. You may find that a carb side mount will do the trick.
Lifting there won't drop the air box much because the lever arm is about 1:3 or so
Mark
Last edited by MarkDa on Mon Nov 06, 2017 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPost by: MarkDa » Mon Nov 06, 2017 11:12 am

Bob
I've got 10mm clearance and the clutch pipe in the gap and haven't noticed any problems.
My engine is not inclined very much - c5/6mm across the timing case since I dropped the carb side.
Hope this helps
Mark
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PostPost by: bloodknock » Mon Nov 06, 2017 1:46 pm

HI Mark
Im looking at 15mm under the edge of the airbox, significant clearance under the carbs See pictures.
Across the top of my rocker box on the "big Valve" Raised area, using a spirit level it falls to the right by 10mm in 18cm so one in eighteen.
I think im looking at lowering the carb side by elongating the holes in the engine mount. If I drop it to 10mm I should see rotation of the engine giving extra gear lever clearance. I dont like having to do this because by my reconing it was once correct. Whats changed???
Attachments
dsc04425.jpg and
fullsizeoutput_1d23.jpeg and
fullsizeoutput_1d20.jpeg and
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PostPost by: MarkDa » Mon Nov 06, 2017 3:23 pm

Bob
For what it's worth I reckoned that I got more drop of the air box per mmm of hole elongation by filing the smaller holes on the engine side when you calculate the lever arm from the centre of the mount the other side. More holes but less removed with filing into the meat of the plate and mount is fixed in compression rather than shear.
You ask 'what's changed' and the answer is new chassis and new mounts, which some might say is everything!
I guess that it's not impossible that the chassis brackets are not the same height and I wouldn't be surprised if the geometry of the mounts is slightly different - I doubt whether manufacturers see them as a high precision components.
Do you still have the originals to compare?

I took my tilt measure in same place and yours is double.
You will get some gearlever movement when you adjust the carb mount and i expect it will be enough to avoid the chassis. However I suspect you'll still be some way off central and a comfortable gaiter fit. Hopefully I'm wrong.
I'm still suspicious about the mounting height on the exhaust side one way or another being the issue.
Keep plugging at it!
Mark.
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Mon Nov 06, 2017 4:22 pm

What if you move the mount you have fitted on the carb side to exhaust side + move exhaust side to carb side.
While you have the mounts off check them side by side to be sure they are different heights :?
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