Lotus Elan

Secondary door seals on S3 coupe

PostPost by: robertverhey » Tue Jul 29, 2014 11:56 am

Hi yet another question....

I have purchased some secondary door seals from rdent and I received two metal strips and a length of flat rubber with raised edge (for each side)

This is different to what I removed from the car when stripping it, ie it had a square profile sponge rubber strip on the flat underside of the door aperture, sweeping up to the angled section.

Does anyone perchance have a photo of how the rdent replacement strips (which I think are closer to the original design) are mounted?

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PostPost by: elanner » Tue Jul 29, 2014 1:58 pm

When I was last at Sue Miller's place picking up the usual laundry list of stuff I purchased a pair of secondary door seals. God knows when/if I'll ever fit them, they're way down low on my to-do list, but I was buying the boot & door seals, so I figured I might as well get them all.

Having no idea what to do with them I took a bunch of photos of the ones fitted to Mick Miller's immaculate Sprint that Sue has next to her shop.

Nick

Elan_SecondaryWeatherStrip1.jpg and

Elan_SecondaryWeatherStrip2.jpg and

Elan_SecondaryWeatherStrip3.jpg and

Elan_SecondaryWeatherStrip4.jpg and

Elan_SecondaryWeatherStrip5.jpg and
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PostPost by: Plus 2 » Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:40 pm

I was most un impressed with the secondary door seal designs and attachment and noted not many even were fitted to many Lotus Elans I previously owned or had seen.

Then after replacing the boot seal on my RR Shadow I discovered it was attached direct to the bodywork with a two pack contact adhesive........and I stress a 'two pack' that has a special additive accelerator.

So I decided to fit the secondary door seal on my +2 the same way and used a section of the rubber that was removed from the old RR boot seal. They have now been in place for over 20 years and for sure they have stuck and no unsightly rivets or metal plates. I do stress however basic impact/contact adhesive will not work. The fact that RR fit the boot seal OE this way with no mechanical lip just direct to the body is reasonable testament to the design function of the two pack adhesive.

I have attached a photo that shows somewhat them in place but not really ever taken any close up for any reason before but can do that if anyone interested.............no digital cameras back then :roll:

In fact I attached one to the door itself at the front inner top and another strip direct to the top inner wing.

Thankfully I have absolutely NO leaks.........essential to protect my nice lambswool floor mates :mrgreen:

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PostPost by: AHM » Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:16 pm

robertverhey wrote:This is different to what I removed from the car when stripping it, ie it had a square profile sponge rubber strip on the flat underside of the door aperture, sweeping up to the angled section.Does anyone perchance have a photo of how the rdent replacement strips (which I think are closer to the original design) are mounted?


The square/rectangular sponge section is original, the "L" shape is a later design.
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PostPost by: robertverhey » Tue Jul 29, 2014 11:40 pm

AHM wrote:The square/rectangular sponge section is original, the "L" shape is a later design.


Oh in that case I think I'll source some original profile rubber section and stick it on. Can't say I'm that impressed with the look of the aftermarket steel strip/rubber rivetted arrangement. Less holes in the body the better I reckon.

Its only job after all is to divert water away from the door apertures to avoid leaks. ACBC's way of getting around a basic design flaw.

Turns out that in a rare moment of foresight I did actually take a photo of the area, albeit after the rubber piece had been removed

Thanks all for assistance, all additions to the store of knowledge!
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PostPost by: type50 » Fri May 10, 2024 3:01 am

I was most un impressed with the secondary door seal designs and attachment and noted not many even were fitted to many Lotus Elans I previously owned or had seen.

Then after replacing the boot seal on my RR Shadow I discovered it was attached direct to the bodywork with a two pack contact adhesive........and I stress a 'two pack' that has a special additive accelerator.

So I decided to fit the secondary door seal on my +2 the same way and used a section of the rubber that was removed from the old RR boot seal. They have now been in place for over 20 years and for sure they have stuck and no unsightly rivets or metal plates. I do stress however basic impact/contact adhesive will not work. The fact that RR fit the boot seal OE this way with no mechanical lip just direct to the body is reasonable testament to the design function of the two pack adhesive.

I have attached a photo that shows somewhat them in place but not really ever taken any close up for any reason before but can do that if anyone interested.............no digital cameras back then :roll:

In fact I attached one to the door itself at the front inner top and another strip direct to the top inner wing.

Thankfully I have absolutely NO leaks.........essential to protect my nice lambswool floor mates :mrgreen:

Regards[/quote]


Hi Steve - Reviving this thread, if I may. I would very much appreciate if you could post close up photos of your +2 secondary door seals, including how they are positioned in the relation to the perimeter door seal. My +2 (50/1060) leaks at this joint and it's time to fix it now that I'm fitting new carpet.

Thanks ! RhodC
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Fri May 10, 2024 5:21 am

The secondary door seals on a +2 are not the same as on an Elan.
Elan is the thin rubber strip held in place by alloy strips and pop rivets.
Elan +2 is a much thicker foam rubber strip with metal strip inside the foam rubber (i think landrover but not sure)
Alan
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PostPost by: Plus 2 » Fri May 10, 2024 5:53 am

I don’t have the Lotus anymore changed to a classic 911 Carrera but my comment was based on the way the seals are fitted rather than using strips of metal pop riveted through you could use the two pack adhesive and it would look neater….I had the Rolls Royce repainted after 15 years in France the sun had taken its toll being a red claret……I fitted the whole huge boot aperture seal using the correct two pack adhesive and it really does bond with no mechanical assistance to keep in place
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Sun May 12, 2024 3:40 am

bonjour Plus 2,
i see on the photo you posted of a white car you have fitted a seal on the moulded lip of the Door.
As far as i know there shouldn't be a seal on the moulded lip of the Door.
I've had 4 different Elans and never seen this.
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PostPost by: Plus 2 » Sun May 12, 2024 5:16 am

The Elan doors are totally different to the +2…..I had 5 Elans and 3 Plus 2’s as well as many other Lotus’ in my days of owning them……actually not one of the Elans or +2 that I owned had any additional door seals fitted….other than the main one around the body aperture….
The Elan +2 initial design actually intended a secondary seal for wind noise around the upper window frame but it did not work as they could not control the gapping well enough…..look at any +2 top metal frame you will see a keyed slot that the rubber was intended to fit into…..with respect to the small front addition seal placed on the upper front door body aperture this was an early factory attempt to resolve the water ingress into the footwell….again it was not that successful as just too much variation in all the shut lines around the doors…that said the Elan +2 was a better hinge arrangement than the Elan and Europa which were just an adjustable cup and ball…….sadly wind noise and water ingress is something you have to live with on many old sports cars but I finally gave up on the old Lotus’ as just got fed up with the Osmosis bubbling on the paint/fibreglass…..the early Jensen is just as bad but I can live with one….the elan door was a lousy fit from day 1 and it used to stick out at the bottom rear but some of us back then used to cut out and re glass the lower door when doing a respray to get them to fit better but I never added anything back then as extra seals and don’t recall the factory did ….
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PostPost by: Sea Ranch » Sun May 12, 2024 5:34 am

Yup.

The 1970 Plus 2S I have came from the factory with the rubber-and-metal riveted-on secondary seal on the upper front of door and/or aperture (can't remember which or both).

I didn't want to keep the metal and the holes in fiberglass so I just use household peel-and-stick weather stripping, which works well. EXCEPT the adhesive isn't good enough. Will be trying it with some serious "2 pack" or urethane glue next :)

Thanks for the tip on glue (and the interesting approach of the Rolls for their boot lid seal). :mrgreen:
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Sun May 12, 2024 6:01 am

Merci Plus 2,
For the info always things to learn.
A+
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PostPost by: Plus 2 » Sun May 12, 2024 4:05 pm

DSCF4020.jpeg and
Hi Sea Ranch, long time since I have been on Lotus forum now just responding out of courtesy as someone asked a question that comes through on email still……yes the Rolls Royce boot seal is quite remarkable and obviously saves a lot of complicated/ expensive panel flanging…..that said it is a lot of fun to fit it as overall it must be about 4 metres all round the aperture of the boot and you have to glue it all in one go both body panel and epdm rubber seal then crawl in the boot to fit it. I have done a few now, it is basically contact adhesive but a two pack and after 24 hours it will pull the paint off or tear the rubber rather than come off where glued….the glue is actually used in marine boats for trimming as withstands damp….anyway all the best and hope you are still enjoying your Lotus
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PostPost by: Sea Ranch » Sun May 12, 2024 8:04 pm

Thanks for the pix and explanation, pal. Big boot, that Rolls, I'm sure.

And yes, still enjoying it. Taken us down the west coast a number of times.

Sorry that you sold yours. I liked the purple top :)

best regards . . .
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