Rear Mirror

[gpaoli]

Hi,
I have bought bullet type rear mirror, it appears to me that to install them on the doors I have to remove the window frame and its mechanism too. Am I right? Anybody could help me?
Thanks in advance for any info.

[GrUmPyBoDgEr]

That is certainly the case on the S4 Elan.
It is also a horrible job because all of the latch/lock wire linkages need to be disconnected & then re-connected.
I'm also having to replace my door mounted mirrors & have devised a trick to avoid that work in future.
Instead of having those 2 separate nuts & washers which fasten the mirror inside of the door I've put 2 "Rivnuts" into a strip of Aluminium.
When I actually fit the mirrors I will use some epoxy adhesive to bond that "nut plate" on to the inner surface of the door.
Later removal or replacement of those mirrors will then be just a screwdriver job.

Photos show a mirror I intent to use to replace bullet mirrors; fixing method is however similar.
Photo 1 shows original fixings with loose nuts & washers
Photo 2 & 3 mirror with self made nut plate using "Rivnuts"

Cheers
John

[69S4]

John, have you had any problems with the weight of the mirror and strength of the wind causing stress cracking on the door? I've no idea whether it would or not but the prospect of it happening stopped me using that sort of mounting. I eventually found a mirror which clamp mounts on the window frame - not ideal thought as it's a bit small.

[jk952]

S2's have a fiberglassed inner panel so inaccessible unless you drill some holes, then risk dropping the bolts into the door - not recommended, which is why they are mouned on the frt fender by the window.

[GrUmPyBoDgEr]

John, have you had any problems with the weight of the mirror and strength of the wind causing stress cracking on the door? I've no idea whether it would or not but the prospect of it happening stopped me using that sort of mounting. I eventually found a mirror which clamp mounts on the window frame - not ideal thought as it's a bit small.

No I've not noticed any crazing but my car has done so few miles since the rebuild.
Originally it had one standard door mirror fitted to the drivers door & it showed no sign of damage but there was damage in all of the areas one would expect.
Others may have different experiences though.
I posted photos of a Bullet mirror which had parted company from my car some time ago.
The bullet itself is "spun" & the material is very thin.
The vibrations it had to absorb were too much & the material fatigued.
Those vibrations are mostly due to race engine mounts, which will never fail like the standard mounts but they do let me know that there's an engine under the bonnet.

By the way, the area of the door where I've mounted my mirrors has a nice rounded profile so that the cross section will be quite stiff & should be able to support the mirror with limited flexing.

Cheers
John

[Frank Howard]

John,

I would suspect that the use of your aluminum plate would stiffen the entire mounting as well. What a brilliant idea!

[GrUmPyBoDgEr]

John,

I would suspect that the use of your aluminum plate would stiffen the entire mounting as well. What a brilliant idea!

Ta!
that could well be.
My aim was, however, to make future life easier 'cus I'm a lazy ol' sod & hate S4 latch/ lock linkages; a total abomination IMHO

John

[Frank Howard]

hate S4 latch/ lock linkages; a total abomination...

John,

I'd like to meet the chap who was installing a dozen of those every day on the factory floor!

[elansprint71]

Back in '76 I fitted bullet mirrors to Elan #1; these were fitted entirely from outside the door skin, on a good-sized mountings using self-tappers. No problems.
Fast-forward to 2000 and Elan #2 and I can't find any bullet mirrors which did not involve getting inside the door. Solution- fitted MGB/Midget mirrors, not as attractive but period olde-fashionede look. No problems.
A few weeks ago I again saw some bullet mirrors which fit from the outside. Moss-Europe stock them, part number 222-372.

The door latches on the S4 are the second worst job on the car.

[Frank Howard]

The door latches on the S4 are the second worst job on the car.

OK Pete. What do you consider to be the worst job?

[GrUmPyBoDgEr]

hate S4 latch/ lock linkages; a total abomination...

John,

I'd like to meet the chap who was installing a dozen of those every day on the factory floor!

So would I, but I don't think I'd like to shake his hand though

[elansprint71]

The door latches on the S4 are the second worst job on the car.

OK Pete. What do you consider to be the worst job?

Steering column on cars fitted with a steering lock! An absolute bastard of a job.

Re the door latches, even the workshop manual and Brian Buckland's book do not show a drawing of exactly how it fits together- because no artist can see inside!

[GrUmPyBoDgEr]

The door latches on the S4 are the second worst job on the car.

OK Pete. What do you consider to be the worst job?

Steering column on cars fitted with a steering lock! An absolute bastard of a job.

Re the door latches, even the workshop manual and Brian Buckland's book do not show a drawing of exactly how it fits together- because no artist can see inside!

Now a sketch of those bits assembled correctly would be a worthwhile challenge for someone with the talent & knowledge of the system.
e.g. which lock cylinder goes into which door?

Cheers
John

[ceejay]

Below are some shots of the mods I have done to my S2 doors. They had also
become quite damaged where the mirror was mounted and also where the
DS & PS door handles are attached.
So during th resto/rebuild we spent the time inlaying and bonding
light sheet metal aluminium reinforcing plates which I think will
cure the problem.

The access hole for the bullet mirror mounting bolts was also enlarged,
there are many things that can be done to the elan body to improve
reliability and to prevent damage from stress cracking etc.

I don't particularly like using self tappers for anything but unfortunately
with the elan body we are forced to use them from in several places.

[GrUmPyBoDgEr]

Hi,
I have bought bullet type rear mirror, it appears to me that to install them on the doors I have to remove the window frame and its mechanism too. Am I right? Anybody could help me?
Thanks in advance for any info.

Hi I'm back again having realised that I got my wires a bit crossed.
The bullet mirrors fitted to my S4 have 2 threaded studs in the mounting & these pass through the door skin & are fastened by loose nuts on the inside of the door.
i.e. no visible fasteners to be seen on the outside of the door.
I assume that it is mirrors like this that you are intending to install?

Well I would say never, ever again!!
The access problems described in this thread would always lead me to a solution that I described earlier, so that the mirrors can be removed / replaced without having to remove the whole innards of the door.

Cheers
John