Fall/Winter/Spring Projects for 0248k

[gjz30075]

I debated pausing the assembly to respray the body. There are more than a few flaws that bug me. But I also want to get the car back on the road. I think the latter urge is winning out, so I'll do what I can with the paint, and deal with it later if I feel compelled to.

Resist the urge. Once on the road, you'll won't get back to it.

Door fit is very nice. I need to go back through the thread to see the 'before'. Probably like mine (0243K)

I'll be there in mine; red, steel wheels with three eared KOs

[RichardHawkins]

Steve,

Door fit looks excellent, better than mine which was corrected by a professional.

I keep thinking about why your engine will not run. Keith Franck summarised, you have fuel, you have a spark, the timing is near enough to work. I also think you said that the engine will run on “easy start fluid”, this sounds like fuel is not being sucked out of the carbs into the engine. I think you have checked the camshaft timing, have you checked the valve clearances? Could there have been some transit packaging left inside the carbs?

Just grasping at straws really,

Richard Hawkins

[steve lyle]

Steve,

Door fit looks excellent, better than mine which was corrected by a professional.

I keep thinking about why your engine will not run. Keith Franck summarised, you have fuel, you have a spark, the timing is near enough to work. I also think you said that the engine will run on “easy start fluid”, this sounds like fuel is not being sucked out of the carbs into the engine. I think you have checked the camshaft timing, have you checked the valve clearances? Could there have been some transit packaging left inside the carbs?

Just grasping at straws really,

Richard Hawkins

Richard,

Thanks for the door comment.

I'm with you re: the straws. Been grasping at a lot of them. I went through and reset the cam timing fairly early on in the diagnosis process. I haven't checked the valve clearance, but I did run a compression check, which was fine, and did the "palm over the trumpet" thing and felt the vacuum on the intake stroke when cranking. I couldn't see any packing material down the carb throats. The real mystery to me is that when I took the carbs off and pumped the throttle shaft, I saw the acceleration pump streams. How can the engine NOT start after a couple of pumps of the throttle?

If they don't find anything wrong with the carbs, I'll: 1) replace the high tension leads - they're not old, but I do have a second set; 2) run a jumper wire from the battery cable at the solenoid to the + terminal of the coil to take the ignition switch out of the process; 3) recheck the distributor timing yet again; 4) do anything else anyone can think of.

[steve lyle]

I debated pausing the assembly to respray the body. There are more than a few flaws that bug me. But I also want to get the car back on the road. I think the latter urge is winning out, so I'll do what I can with the paint, and deal with it later if I feel compelled to.

Resist the urge. Once on the road, you'll won't get back to it.

Door fit is very nice. I need to go back through the thread to see the 'before'. Probably like mine (0243K)

I'll be there in mine; red, steel wheels with three eared KOs

Which urge do you want me to resist?

Looking fwd to seeing your car, see you and it in three days.

[Craven]

“I saw the acceleration pump streams. How can the engine NOT start after a couple of pumps of the throttle? “
Steve I know it’s almost universal to start up by pumping the throttle OK if it fires but if it doesn’t then the chances are you pump the throttle again flooding the engine. Once you have wet plugs you will be lucky to ever start and the more you try the worse the situation gets, fit a new and I say new set of plugs and start with the choke, if it’s going to start it will. Why people insists in washing oil from the bores on a cold engine increasing wear I will never understand I think it’s boy racer thing or something. A Twin cam in good order is a very easy starter when at operating temperature it will start instantly without any input from the driver.

[RichardHawkins]

Steve,

Reference Cravens comments about fouled plugs. There was a magazine I read (Practical Performance Car) that I miss, one of the contributors runs a rolling road service and reported on the problems he had encountered. One point he made is that by the time they have got the fuel injection nearly right the plugs are fouled and no amount of cleaning will bring them back, he fits another set and continues. His opinion is that plugs have changed since the days of carburettors when mixture control was not as precise as with electronic fuel injection and that plugs do not have resist occasional fouling as they used to. I respect this man, I think he talks sense. For the cost of a set of plugs give it a try.

Hope this helps,

Richard Hawkins

[2cams70]

What exact model carbs did you purchase?
What are the model numbers stamped on the top cover?

There could be anything inside. These are calibrated items containing lots of calibrated parts. Forums are one thing but it really is best to pick up a few books to read.

[steve lyle]

What exact model carbs did you purchase?
What are the model numbers stamped on the top cover?

There could be anything inside. These are calibrated items containing lots of calibrated parts. Forums are one thing but it really is best to pick up a few books to read.

They’re DCOE 40 151’s. The main and idle jets are 120 and 45, as recommended by Barry Sale of PHP Racengines, based on his records of similar engine profiles to mine.

Randy at Weber warranty service was fine with the main jets, but will be changing out the idle jets to 50s, although he doesn’t think that explains the non-start, or other, issues I’m seeing. Which is why he has the carbs now.

Books are fine, but wouldn’t you agree it really is best to rely on experts with years, even decades, of experience with these carbs on this engine. . And I do have books.

[2cams70]

When I say books I’m mainly talking about the original factory manuals. They exist for both the car itself and the Webers. After all there is no better source of information than information from those who created these things in the first place. By all means also listen to what others have to say but you also need independent research and that tool between your ears to filter the useful from the rubbish. Without knowledge of your own it can be difficult to tell who is an “expert” and who isn’t and no one is ever an expert in all areas.

What size chokes and auxiliary venturies are in those Webers?

[steve lyle]

Back from LOG, and work continues.

First, LOG 42. A bit disappointed that we couldn't drive the Elan, but then, it was HOT. I spent my time on the field getting ideas on what could be wrong with my car, noting how nice Greg Z's and The Veg's cars were, and taking pics of details of the windscreen header rail trim and Weber throttle linkages. But, sorry, didn't take any general car shots - did I mention it was HOT?

Anyway, nice trip, and it was great to link up with Greg and TV and the other Elan and Lotus owners we met.

So, back at it. First up, what's happening with the carbs? Well, the Weber warranty people have had them for 2+ weeks at this point. I've called a couple of times - all they will tell me is "we're still working on them". Whether they means they've found a problem and they're trying to fix it, or they haven't done anything yet and don't want to admit it, I can't say. Hopefully the former. I'll call them again after Labor Day.

The windscreen header rail trim was next on my list. First up, this meant I had to remove the windscreen, since the vinyl trim is supposed to be wrapped around the windscreen flange before putting the seal on. So with a gulp, I pulled out the locking strip, removed the windscreen and pulled off the seal. So far, so good.

Next up the top retaining rail and visor supports got riveted on. I used steel rivets with backing washers. 1/8" dia X 1/4" long. I put a washer between the aluminum piece and the fiberglass rail in a couple of places where it looked like there wouldn't be enough gap for the top to fit if I didn't.

I cut out a piece of vinyl matching my recovered dash pad using the old trim as a template, and used contact cement to glue it to the flange, after poking a couple of holes in it for the visors.

After letting that sit over night, the windscreen seal went on, then the glass went in, then the locking strip. I had purchased a couple of special tools for the locking strip, but ended up not using them. I found it pretty easy to put the lower edge of the locking strip in the seal, then use a plastic spudger to lift up the top lip of the seal while pressing in the locking strip under it. It took maybe 5 minutes to do the entire strip that way.

Ben, who helped me with the windscreen the first time, and did the dash pad recover, also rebuilt my visors. I'm particularly happy with them - much less expensive than the repros that are hard to come by, and much better looking to my eye.

Nexty, the top edge of the vinyl was glued on to the fiberglass edge. I re-used the old foam, gluing it in place. Then the A-pillar trim pieces went in, I sealed the back edge of the top retaining strip with silicon sealant, and the outer gasket went on. All in all it looks pretty good,

No doubt the A-pillar trims flanges are supposed to fit under the windscreen seal. Unfortunately, they come untrimmed, and when I trimmed them I took too much of that flange off. So mine are held in by the top gasket on the outer edge, which just pushes them up to the seal, kind of jamming them in. I. think that should work, if not I'll use some sort of adhesive on that edge.

Finally, I used some black sealant on the windscreen seal lower corners where the 'as delivered' miters, which weren't the correct angle, split when the glass was installed. The silicon blends well with the rubber - you'd have to be looking pretty closely to notice.

Now it's on to the rest of the interior trim. And bugging the Weber guys.

[The Veg]

It was good meeting you Steve! And thanks for calling my car 'nice!' To me it's a diamond in the rough so I appreciate that.

[steve lyle]

It was good meeting you Steve! And thanks for calling my car 'nice!' To me it's a diamond in the rough so I appreciate that.

Any 50+ year old British car that can be driven as far as yours was is nice, and a credit to the owner/mechanic! And it was at least the 2nd nicest +2 on the field!

[steve lyle]

The last couple of days, I've been struggling with the force required to open the driver's door with the external door handle. I don't remember this being a problem prior to disassembly, so I was quite confused. The passenger door was no problem at all. It was somewhat better with the door seal removed, but still much more resistant than the passenger door with the seal installed.

In fact, at first when I installed the seal, I couldn't open the door from the outside at all. So I spent a day or so adjusting the linkage from the door handle to the latch. That enabled me to get the door open, but I had to use two thumbs on the handle button to do so. Next, since my seal was pretty ratty, and a bit short, already, I trimmed some of the seal flap off to reduce the outward pressure on the latch when closed. This got the effort down to one uncomfortable thumb push.

So everything came apart, and I found that there was quite a bit of resistance in the door handle button push, even when it was off the car. Again - I don't recall this being an issue when I took the car apart. No amount of lubrication seemed to help.

So, door handles disassembly time.

First up, there are two screws holding the door handle push-button mechanism together. They retain a pot-metal plate, When you remove one screw, the internal spring pressure wants to lever the plate against the remaining screw, putting too much strain on the plate, and breaking it. So be forewarned.

Then, once you get the plate off, I found a nylon tube with a flange at one end that fits into the inside of the push button. At the other end the tube is tapped for a screw that is the contact point for the actuation lever. At that outer end the tube passes through a hole in the retaining plate. In my case, the screw had split the tube, expanding it, such that it barely fit through then hole, significantly increasing the effort required to depress the button.

Of course, there's no rebuild kit available for these things. So I've got a pair of door handles (the only way they're sold) on the way from RDE, for $239. Ouch. But saving me the effort of somehow fabbing up the plate and tube - which I think is beyond my skills anyway. And I'll have a handle ready to go if/whenever the passenger side fails.

[steve lyle]

Lots of progress in the last week.

Biggest news is carb related. I got a call from Randy at the Weber US warranty provider (Red Line) today re: my carbs. He basically said that they were junk - the first bad SET from the factory that he's seen in 9 years in this job. Bent shafts, which he says I couldn't. have done. So they're sending me a new set. Also he said that the "off the shelf" carbs that I bought had 50% bypass valves on the accelerator pumps, and that if I had bought them in kit form for my car (are they even available?) they would have 0% pump bypass valves - so they'll put those in the carbs they're sending me. So I was getting half a shot of fuel from the pumps, which at least partially explains my problem - the bent shafts being the other part. I reminded him that he wanted 50 idle jets as well, when the 'as delivered' were 45's, and they'll do that too. Extremely odd that both carbs had the same problem, which he could not explain, but they're going to test run my new carbs after configuration, and he's confident that they'll get me on the road.

Meanwhile, my new door handles came from RDE. Big difference - the driver's door now opens with one reasonable thumb push on the button. I got a new door seal from them as well. So the doors are on, the windows, latches and speakers all work. The passenger door I'd call perfect. The driver's door requires a bit more force to close, and I'd prefer it close a bit more more than it does. But after a day the seal is more compressed and the door closes with less effort, so I'll give it some more time before possibly trimming the seal a bit.

I was holding off on putting the under dash heater valence trim panels on until I was able to test all the electrics involving under dash wiring. The door speakers were the last of that, so those are on now as well. Very fiddly, but hopefully the last time for a while that I'll have to work under the dash on my back.

The rear cockpit top shelf that holds the top and frame is in, another fiddly job, along with the top frame. I glued the interior rocker trim panels in - that made putting on the door seal much easier. Looks very nice.

I'm running out of parts to put on the car. Headlights and front turn signals, the air filter in the nose, the horns and the radiator overflow bottle are left to do. And the last of the painting - the bumpers, another couple of coats on the bonnet, and then some touchups on the body. With any remaining time I'll touch up the wheels as well.

The 'Brits in the Ozarks' show is the first weekend in October, and we've been going to that for the last 10 years. It looks like there's a good chance we'll be in the Elan this year, not the B.

[gjz30075]

Good to hear on the carbs. So wierd. It's looking good though!