Converting a +2S to Spyder chassis with a Zetec

[Spinney]

What are the thoughts on carrying out this conversion to a +2S 130? Being mindful of wanting to retain originality as much as possible, I am however aware the Spyder conversion and particularly the 2L Zetec with 5 sp Ford gearbox will make it a more enjoyable drive. So whilst it undoubtedly makes the car more reliable/useable, is it really in the spirit of the car to change it to this extent?

I am undecided on which direction to go - originality or practicality? Any thoughts please?

[jono]

I wrestled with this for ages but finally decided that the car would no longer be a Lotus without the TC. I had the TC rebuilt and mildy tuned and will be running it on Jenvey TB's + Emerald ECU.

The Jenveys are available in crackle black which even look period

I don't think the Zetec would be more fun - quicker perhaps but Elan is all about handling and character IMO. The TC is the heart of the car, don't rip it out (all IMO of course!)

Jono

[andyelan]

Hi there

Please define exactly a "more enjoyable drive"

Andy

[Spinney]

Ok, well by more enjoyable I am thinking for starters 40 bhp more, good reliability and peace of mind, cheaper to repair/replace should the worst happen, more torque and easily tuned to 200+ bhp whilst retaining good road manners.

I have owned twin cams in the distant past and more recently a tuned Zetec engine in a Caterham and for sure, the more modern engine is far easier to live with on a day to day basis. Furthermore, the gearchange quality of the Ford Type 9 'box is, in my view, far superior to the Elans 5 speed and there are several ratio options available.

All these factors combine, again in my view, to make for a more enjoyable drive although I do worry about whether or not I should concern myself more with keeping the car original.

[andyelan]

Well Spinney, It looks like you've already made up your mind so go for it.

One general question I have though, and that's, why is it that Plus 2s seem to benerfit more from Zetec conversions than do the 2 seaters. In general there doesn't seem the same interest in "improving" Elans in this way so I can only assume Twin Cams work fine when installed in these cars. I wonder why that is.

Andy

[rocket]

I have no problem with originality but i would never swop my twincam for another engine..it makes the car what it is.If i wanted a zetec engine id buy a modern Ford,simple as that.

Ian.

[msd1107]

Andy said:

One general question I have though, and that's, why is it that Plus 2s seem to benerfit more from Zetec conversions than do the 2 seaters.

Well, a +2 is a heavy car, compared with the Elan, so the additional power from a Zetec conversion is much appreciated. Many Elan owners are modifying their TC engines into the 130-150 hp region, with corresponding performance increases. To get to the same performance level, the +2 probably needs 150-190 hp, which the Zetec can achieve with good drivability but the TC can't.

Also, the Elan owners seem to live with their 3.55 or lower differential ratios. A Zetec conversion usually has a 5-speed box, so the car is more enjoyable in a wide range of driving situations.

Just my opinion.

David
1968 36/7988

[rocket]

Im happy with the power to weight of my plus 2,it is a pleasure to drive,completely different to my modern sports car which has more power but is no more fun to drive...then theres my bike which makes 200bhp and weighs 170 kgs..some engines belong in some vehicles...i think so anyway.

Ian.

[Spinney]

No, I haven't yet made up my mind by any means but I am interested to hear the views of existing owners. It seems to me from looking at the classifieds that the Elan is maybe considered more of a classic than the +2 and so there is good reason for them to remain unmolested. The +2, however, for some reason I can't quite understand doesn't seem to be held in such high regard and so there is perhaps less reason to keep it original maybe?

I have always loved Lotus cars of all types and I do recall being particularly smitten with the +2 when it was announced. It was a great car then when fitted with the twin cam but I just wonder if it could equally be great by todays standards when fitted with a more modern engine and drive train. I do also own an Elise SC which is another great Lotus of its time but it has a totally different character to the +2 which would, I think, still retain its original qualities and classic feel but with the added attraction of modern day reliability.

I need to ponder some more before committing I think. Thanks for your input so far and I welcome all views from both sides of the argument to help me make up my mind.

[Spinney]

As an addendum to the above, are there any +2 owners on here who have been through this conversion and would care to comment on what the car was like to own and drive, both pre and post rebuild? How does it compare in terms of driveability for example, and has anybody actually regretted carrying it out?

TIA

[terryp]

I think the choice really boils down to whether you want to drive a classic car or whether you want a modern sports car. And if you want a modern sports car , its probably better to buy one. But you have an Elise, so why molest another +2?
Yes the twincam has its problems (My Leaks!!!) but its a beautiful and iconic engine and the 4 speed gearbox I love as its nothing like a modern car. On country lanes its perfect. OK on motorways its a bit noisy, so don't go on motorways.
I think the question would be to the many investors in cars (I'm not one), in 10 years time, what car will be worth more, a well sorted twincam +2 or a Zetec +2. My money would be on the twincam.

Terry

[dmode]

The Twin cam can be both without leaks, and quite comfortable with a fifth gear. Mine does not leak, and yes it has oil in it I do not get the zetec conversion? In my humble opinion a zetez engined Elan, is no longer a Lotus. I take pride in opening the bonnet, and in Denmark a Lotus is very rare car, but every petrolhead knows how important the twin cam was in its time. I would not have the same pride in showing an engine compartment with a Mondeo engine!! Also in my opinion at least, a +2 is a gt car, not a sportscar as such. The performance you get from a big valve twin cam is more than enough to furfill the cars gt purpose. A +2 is very hard to beat for value for money if it is a comfortable, iconic, beautyfull, rare, sports gt your heart is lusting after. I have owned more than 15 classic cars, and the only thing that comes close to the +2, is my old 67 Porsche. But that was a lot more money, and not remotely as rare as the Lotus. Keep the car original!

[fitzy1]

I did a Spyder zetec conversion on my 1972 plus 2 and I love it. Now use it as a regular daily driver with greater confidence than before. The roadholding is if anything better than before ,it's faster, smoother doesn't overheat and is generally a joy to drive .
I know such conversions upsets the purists and I fully respect their views but for me I would not change it back.
As to its value against a TC I simply don't know or care as it's not for sale.
Do what's right for you ....it's your life and your car.

[Spinney]

Hmm some divergent views there which all help thanks. I have to admit that whilst I am minded to try and keep the car as original as possible, I am not bothered about values in years to come. My intention is to use the car reasonably regularly, including the drive to work occasionally, so practicality and reliability are paramount.

I think I will try to get a look at a Spyder conversion if I can and decide after that.

Keep the views coming though please.

[andyelan]

Hi Everyone

I think it often easy to confuse Value and Price. To my mind a Plus 2 is a Valuable car irrespective of how much money it would fetch when sold. It's that Value I woud wish to preserve.

Perhaps there's a lesson to be learnt here from the Trumph Stag. Years ago everyone seemed to be swapping engins for Rover V8s or Ford V6s on the pretext of reliability. Since then however specialists have got on top of all the problems and the car is now reliable and quite a desirable classic, roughly on par with the Plus 2 I would suggest. A Stag without its original engine is worth next to nothing and thats assuming a buyer can be found.

Bottom line for me though is that most people seem to want Zetec conversions for the sake of more power. Well as I only uses my car on the road I can't even make use of a fraction of the cars 120mph potentional (70 mph speed limit, speed cameras, busy roads etc). For me at least 125bhp is more than enough power to enable me to loose my driving licence if I so choose to do so

Andy