Lotus Elan

zetec engine in lotus chassis on 2+2

PostPost by: c42 » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:52 pm

Hi Keith

Yes the engine mounts are standard Lotus mounted upside down to make them "safe" and I have a 3mm steel plate approximately 100mm x 150mm behind them welded to the chassis to spread the load.

The sump cut is 225mm from the gearbox face up to the shallow level.

I think the diesel was the Endura unit and I have tried to look at a diesel sump on engines for sale on ebay and whilst the pictures are not brilliant the sump appears to be different but you would need to see one along with the bolt pattern to be sure, interestingly the 1.8lt CVH engine has the same sump bolt pattern as the Zetec apart from 2 holes that need drilling so it is not out of the question that the diesel pattern may be the same.

Bud, do you have a picture of your sump.

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John
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PostPost by: c42 » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:55 pm

Keith I should have said that my sump is from a 1996 petrol 1.8lt Silvertop engined Escort .

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PostPost by: Bud English » Tue Apr 10, 2012 10:03 pm

John-
Here's what I'm dealing with, as installed on the motor.
US Zetec Sump 4.jpg and


Several people have modified the steel portion of the sump to increase the ground clearance for locost's and other kit cars. They slice off the bottom of the pan even with the low side fastening points and parallel with the block mating face of the aluminum upper sump. About like my line A. That's not enough clearance for the cross member and anti-roll bar in the +2. It needs to be about at my line B. Well, maybe not quite that high, but close.

Here's a couple of pictures of the extra sump I picked up to modify, with and without the steel lower pan. I can't come up with a way to do it cleanly, but now have one extra aluminum upper and two extra steel lower sumps.
US Zetec Sump 1.jpg and

US Zetec Sump 2.jpg and

US Zetec Sump 3.jpg and
Last edited by Bud English on Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPost by: c42 » Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:37 am

Hi Bud

That looks the same as our Blacktop zetec unit, the best I can suggest in the short term is to join this forum http://www.turbosport.co.uk/forum.php and place an ad in the wanted section for an Escort Zetec front wheel drive sump and pick up pipe or altenatively look for a 1.8lt CVH sump and cut and carve that about - alot of work but not too technical and at least it is made of steel.

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John
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PostPost by: c42 » Wed Apr 11, 2012 12:08 pm

I am not sure if this will help as I have no idea what an MX5 sump looks like!

http://www.turbosport.co.uk/showthread. ... -MX-5-sump

Regards
John

edit: just realised that it is for a Duratec so probably no help at all.
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PostPost by: Bud English » Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:43 pm

I'm trying to sort out if the sump from a North American spec 1.9l or 2.0l escort or tracer will work.

Here's one on ebay. (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2000-Ford-Escor ... 0734732036) It looks right, but I can't seem to find any information confirming that it will work.

I'd hate to add one to my growing collection to find out. The closest salvage yard is two hours away, but I may have to make the trip and go find one. I can take one of my zetec sumps and compare. If it will work the cost will be about the same as the shipping cost for one from the UK.
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PostPost by: c42 » Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:44 pm

Hi Bud

I have just pm'd a guy in Boston who contributes to the Turbosport forum, he was trying to fit a 1.9lt onto a Zetec - if he answers it will either solve your problem or at least reduce the options.

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John
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PostPost by: Bud English » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:01 am

Thanks John. Your right. Sounds like I need to register with them.

How's your project coming? I finished my , now politically corrected, "sub-frame" mods (including motor mounts of your design, thanks again). I have the sub-frame painted and I'm starting to get the suspension and brakes together. It's amazing how the costs of all the little things add up. After sitting dormant for 30+ years every seal needs to be changed. Most everything else is good though if it doesn't break changing the seals.

I keep saying it, but I'll get some pictures posted soon.
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PostPost by: tablets32 » Wed May 09, 2012 7:15 pm

hi,

been a while since i posted, waiting for the sump i modified to come back from the welder. i have repaired and recovered the main loom, having the welding done to the chassis mods next week. repositioned the fuel pump to the boot along with the filter. will begin rebuilding the interior on sunday. using a tip from a headlining fitter who i worked with at fords back in the day, he recommends warming the lining up before fitting, so 10 minutes in the tumble drier should do the job! i have to source windscreen and rear screen rubbers, and hopefully the chrome windscreen surrounds.

you guys are progressing your mods well, the sump for the blacktop pictured in buds posts is one i have never seen before. looks like a big job to mod the original to fit, it,s a good idea to change it for an escort sump.

i will be making some templates for my engine mounts when i get the sump back, the mounts will be made by a friend, i will keep the templates in case anyone else needs them.

thats all for now, keep the info coming :) will post some more pics next time.

Keith
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PostPost by: Bud English » Sun May 13, 2012 6:34 pm

Keith - It sounds like you're making great progress. I still haven't sorted out my sump problem but it's not holding anything up at this point.

I'm almost back to the rolling chassis stage. All my AVO type frame mods are complete. The chassis is painted and the front suspension, rack and new solid rack mounts are back in.

Steering Rack Mounts 4.jpg and
The solid rack mount kit is a spitfire item that's made here in the US.

Lt Front Corner 2.jpg and
The brake calipers have all been rebuilt and the fronts are installed. I have made up and installed all the new bundy pipes that can be fitted before the body goes back on. I had a few problems sourcing pads and SS brake hoses. My Greenstuff pad saga is in a thread in the +2 section. The hose problem was just a vendor mistake that they are correcting.

New Spring & Adj Perch 3.jpg and
I added adjustable spring perches to the rear suspension along with 2 1/2" diameter springs. There is some info and pictures of that DIY adventure in the elan section in a thread on Tyre/Spring Perch Interference.

I didn't post that stuff here because it has little to do with the Zetec mod.

My brother recently asked if my project was still fun. Oh yeah, it's still fun and so fulfilling after watching the car sit idle for 30+ years.
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PostPost by: david g » Thu May 17, 2012 8:57 pm

hello you zetec boys .bud can you go to www.zetec-cat.co.uk continue to pauls kit car and fitment.they show a sump chop, it may help .i used a Retro ford steel sump ,very good .I will put some pics up if you want. David
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PostPost by: tablets32 » Fri May 25, 2012 5:35 am

hi,

where are you guys sourcing your clutch, flywheel and starter motors from? i understand that i will need a pinto sohc starter, mine is on the drivers side of the engine. but i have had doubtfull replies as far as the clutch and flywheel are concerned? i spoke to a guy at burtons who thinks that the clutch housings they sell will be too big for the bullet bell housing. fella at spyder was just as negative. i have pm/d grumpy bodger but am waiting for a reply. all the indications on the forum point to there being no problems associated with this kit, but i still need some more info.
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PostPost by: Bud English » Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:21 pm

Hi Keith,

Didn?t mean to drop totally out of this thread, I just didn?t have a good answer for you. ?and still don?t. I too am still sorting out the whole clutch/flywheel problem. I?ve read all sorts of conflicting info on the subject and won?t throw money at it until I?m sold on one plan over the other. Part of me wants to go the easy (read ?expensive?) route and just order up a clutch, flywheel, and bell housing and be done with it. But that?s just not me. I usually go the DIY route, spend just as much money and twice as much time and come up with questionable results. Wow, I sure make a good argument for that plan, don?t I?

Along that same line of thinking, I did order up a 1.9L, Mercury Lynx, sump to try to modify. Should be here Wednesday?.

*Update 8/7/2012- For anyone in the US attempting this mod, the 1990 - 1996 Escort/Tracer, 1.9l SOHC pan, as sold in the US, works. It looks to be identical to the pics in John's post.
Last edited by Bud English on Tue Aug 07, 2012 6:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPost by: c42 » Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:32 pm

Hi Keith, which gearbox are you using?

Regards
John
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PostPost by: Bud English » Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:59 pm

John, I know the question was for Keith but in case you have any suggestions I?m replying as well?

I?m trying to stay with the 2000E transmission to keep costs down. Type 9?s and MT75?s are pretty scarce in the states or I?d probably go that route.

Staying with the 2000E does have its own problems. Here?s part of an email to Ian at RWD Motorsport, one of the potential sources for conversion parts, in answer to some of his questions. He, too, is not sure his setup will fit into the Lotus bellhousing?

?The Lotus flywheel looks to be the same diameter as the stock Zetec. The Lotus does use the smaller diameter clutch disk. I had planned to find an 8 1/2" disk with the correct 7/8" splines to match the 2000E transmission to use with the Pinto pressure plate on your flywheel.

One thing I've noticed already is that there seems to be two types of lightened flywheels out there. The one like yours with the step up to the original (?) friction surface height, places the clutch disk splines correctly on the transmission splines. This also positions the clutch cover farther back in the bellhousing and may cause interference.
RWD Motorsport Flywheel.jpg
RWD Motorsport Flywheel.jpg (15.68 KiB) Viewed 2310 times

The other type like the one sold by Burton, Turbosport.net, and others, looks to be flatter. That would put the clutch closer to the engine/bellhousing split, leaving more clearance in the bellhousing for the clutch cover. The problem I see with that is that the clutch disc splines wouldn't be engaging the splines fully on the 2000E transmission.
Zetec flywheel pinto clutch.jpg and
Turbosport.net Flywheel

I?ll bolt up the original clutch and flywheel and take some measurements tomorrow. If this fits, it will be very close.?

If the stock Zetec clutch/flywheel set up will fit into the bell housing, I may go that route using the correct disk to mate with the transmission. I really wanted to shed some of the weight of the 2.0 Zetec flywheel.
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