Lotus Elan

Dunlop Tires

PostPost by: jkolb » Sat Oct 07, 2006 1:02 am

Anyone have any experience racing the Elan on Dunlop Formula Ford tires?

TIA

Jerry
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PostPost by: Sarah Ryan » Sun Oct 08, 2006 9:32 am

Hi I used to run both Dunlop & Avon's formulae ford fronts on the Elan, but you need to have the smaller rear spring platform to have them clear. Once up to temperature there is not many cars that will stay with you through corners. Pressures are critical. But why these tyres as there are plenty of performance radials you can run?
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PostPost by: jkolb » Sun Oct 08, 2006 10:27 am

Just the thought that the suspension (26R) was designed for this type of tire. I have the small springs in the rear, and 13X6 rims, which radials would you recommend?

Jerry
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PostPost by: Sarah Ryan » Sun Oct 08, 2006 11:34 am

Hi you didn't mention you were after 26R style stuff. The 26r raced on those style of tyres how many years ago. I guess that was all or the best that was available. I ran that style of tyre many years ago as they performed better than the run of the mill road tyres. Then came Yoko A008r that reset the benchmark.

Try a Toyo trampio 08r 175-60-13 = latest construction better rubber & less expensive than a formular Ford tyre or try a Yokohama.
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PostPost by: Dag-Henning » Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:56 pm

Jerry, - I race my Elan ( widebody) on Dunlop Racing, with the CR65 pattern which is the tyre to use under the FIA App. K regulation for the "-65 class" - that is Elan S1 and 2.
On a 6" rim, I use 5.25 M section, but that requires the 26R wheelarches. On a std. body you can run the 4.50M section tyres. The grip is not at all sensational, but very predictable and great fun !! These were the tires the car was intended for, - no question -, but there has been improvements in 40 years.......(!)
However, if you are running 3/8" wheel studs, too much grip can make life exciting...- maybe more than you wish........ :shock:

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PostPost by: jkolb » Sun Oct 08, 2006 10:59 pm

Why the 175 rather than the 185 Toyo?

Rohan - if you are monitoring this thread, what do you think? I remember a comment you made once that Elans were most effective on the track against competition that was running restricted tires. Does the Elan suspension, with good shocks and the 26R adjustability mods, work best with period type tires, or sticky radials?

Jerry
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Mon Oct 09, 2006 11:40 am

Jerry

I ran formula ford fronts on my Elan about 15 years ago when they were full slicks and was running in a production sports car class where slicks were allowed before the Elan moved to historic racing. Handling with the ff slicks was great with excellent control on the limit and I posted some of my fastest ever lap times on them. Performance and lap times very similar to Hoosier Street TD's which are a simlar cross ply construction with a race compound and with a very nominal tread.

Dont know what modern ff tyres are like but I would suspect they perform much like a Hoosier still if still made specifically to suit a ff. Historic dunlop racing tyres are a very different beast. I have run on them a couple of times as they are an option in our class versus modern treaded tyres such as the Hoosiers or Yoko A-032R but they are significantly slower compared to the modern tyre option allowed.

If you are not allowed a specific racing tyre I believe the Hoosier street TD or Yoko A032R soft compound are your best options. If allowed racing tyres then a large range of sizes, and compounds with or without treads available. The Dunlop ff front is probably a good choice as at least it fits and is designed for a relatively light weight car. When I raced the ff fronts I used second hand half worn tyres as the rears wore out faster than the fronts so lots of cheap fronts available. The older tyres also lasted longer as I found that new tyres overheated quickly on the Elan after about 5 laps on a tight circuit.

175/60 x 13 profiles will usually fit all Elans with small rear springs and a reasonale atempt at getting the right wheel offset provided the body is not to off centre. Depending on section width and how precisely you centre the tyre in the front and rear guards some 185's will fit and some will not. Generally you will need different front and rear wheel offsets to fit a 185 to an Elan without rubbing. For example the Hoosier 185/60 are actually narrower than the Yoko A032R 175/60.

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PostPost by: rgh0 » Mon Oct 09, 2006 12:47 pm

Jerry

A couple of further comments I forgot.

My comment on Elans performing best in restricted tyre classes is due to the Elans relatively narrow track. With sticky tyres and standard track you get to the ultimate limit on a Elan and start to 2 wheel in corners before most other cars.

Limit the tyre grip and other cars drop off corner speed quicker than an Elan once you dont have to worry about 2 wheeling.

Also Elans dont like really stiff suspensions as you start to break things, but you need a stiff suspension to get stable and predicable handling out of modern sticky tyres especially with the fairly large camber changes in an Elans suspension. The Elan handles better will its compliant suspension on older tyres with higher sidewalls and less sticky rubber.

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PostPost by: jkolb » Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:35 am

Thanks!
I need to buy a set of wheels - what offset would you recommend? I am going to buy Superlite wheels from Australia. The seem to be a quality wheel and the racing version is light.

Jerry
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PostPost by: elandoc » Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:29 am

Jerry,
I run 26R guards on my S3 DHC. I recently put a set of Superlights on - not exactly light weight, but very strong and reasonably priced. I run 13x6 on the front with a narrow offset (= bigger backspace - there are two sizes, pick the one spaced in the most). On these I run Yoko A 032 R in 185/60, but I've seen 205/60 fit under on a six" rim (Peter Landan's very quick 26R replica). On the rear I run a 13x7 rim with 205/60 32Rs. This is in an effort to ease the nasty oversteer I've been getting. They fit under very well, although in Oz Yokohama won't import the supersoft/wet compound and I'm going to probably try Toyo RA 1s next. The Yoko's have done three years of hill climbs and the odd sprint, plus a Classic Adelaide and a Targa Tasmania and are only now wearing out - a bit hard for the little Elan, I think. The Toyos, by all accounts, are a bit softer.
Patrick
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PostPost by: cabc26b » Fri Oct 13, 2006 5:18 pm

Hi Jerry,

Ok, since nobody else will chime in for Avon I will. I have used their Bias-ply's for awhile now and like them just fine ( i have not tried radials on my race car yet) . You have options , you can run the ACB9's which are molded tread - 5.0x22x13 or if you have the fenders try the 6.5x23x13's , you cab also have the acb0's slicks cut with a age appropriate tred pattern. curently I am useing the ACB10's in 7.0x22x13 on 6 inch rims ( running s2 26r body work with 26r wheels ) . The acb10's are a more modern block pattern. On the ACB0 and 9's I used a middle of he road compound and found they would last about 4-5 events . I have only 2 events on the 10's so can't tell how long they will last .[/i]
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PostPost by: Terry Posma » Thu Oct 26, 2006 3:11 pm

Jerry,

The 175/60/13 Toyos are very large tyres - lots of sidewall height and tread width. They are much larger than the 185/65/13s I have on a plus 2.

I would be surprised if they fit under 26r guards as I have used cigarette paper to measure the clearances. :roll:

Terry.
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PostPost by: twincamman » Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:29 am

I have 205 x 13 x on the rear and 185 x 13 front made by Hankook ------the car can take 205 all around ---ed
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PostPost by: scott » Wed Jan 31, 2007 1:13 am

Now that the yoko a32r's are no longer available does anyone have a good high performance option? Toyos seem to be pretty large. Hoosiers are an option, but have no rain capability. Has anyone tried sumitomo htrs? Scott
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PostPost by: jrwiseman » Fri Jun 08, 2007 6:35 pm

scott wrote:Now that the yoko a32r's are no longer available does anyone have a good high performance option? Toyos seem to be pretty large. Hoosiers are an option, but have no rain capability. Has anyone tried sumitomo htrs? Scott


Hi Scott

I ended up purchasing a set of the Sumitomo htr 200s in 175/50-13 for my s2. They serve as rain/street tires and work pretty well although they are pretty short :) I use the hoosier street td for dry weather events [ where as in the past I could use the yokos for everything ].

have fun
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