Lotus Elan

my Elan SPRINT refurbishment by LOG36 ??

PostPost by: tedtaylor » Tue Apr 26, 2016 7:32 pm

Thanks John. Yes, I know Ray very well and will be utilizing RDent, Dave Bean, and others as i go.

So as not to clutter up too much of this blog with too many pictures, I've decided to post most of the general detail picture shots of my Sprint on a special page of my "hobby" website. The link is here if anyone wants to look at detail shots of the car. I'll post more as time goes by.

http://www.taylormadeclassiccars.com/sprintslides.html
TED
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PostPost by: gjz30075 » Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:23 pm

Get as much info as you can from the previous owner. I see an alternator and I wonder if he put it on or
was there a factory transition to an alternator, at some point. I think there was but Tim W can probably
tell us. My car, 0243K, came with a generator.

I also see regular lap belts and nothing coming out of the slots in the rear bulkhead, indicating to me he
probably ditched the retractables because the reels get messed up, and replaced them with simple
lap belts.
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PostPost by: tedtaylor » Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:47 pm

Good eye Greg! Yes, it came with generator and the original owner changed it out for the alternator. The generator and regulator box came with the car by way of extra parts in boxes. He said he switched to the alternator and removed the regulator box and rewired it as such.

He also removed the reel shoulder belts when the roll bar was installed and plugged up the slot openings with extra carpet from behind. I'm not sure if I have those reel shoulder belts or not, so I'll have to check on that.

I did a test fit today and found the cockpit too tight for me WITH the rollbar. It's a shame, since the rollbar is perfect, nice paint, no rust, and since the rear "cardboard" bulkhead was cut to bolt the roll bar to the shock tower and/or reel belt connection points? The other connection points are using the safety belt bolts at the floor level, so it should be simple enough to take out. Then i'll be able to adjust the seat back fully and then better fit myself behind the wheel.

Anyone want to buy the rollbar?
TED
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PostPost by: lotustastic » Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:11 am

Beautiful find...


I may be interested in the rollbar, I'm restoring an s3 super safety coupe, as the roll bar is coming from a drop head, I wonder if it would clear the roof line ok (maybe great to get a vertical measurement of bar from rear deck lid up to highest point to verify while still installed) . Does the roll bar force you to place the driver seat in the forward slot position?


Thanks

Dave
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PostPost by: pharriso » Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:34 am

NIce buy Ted,I talked with the owner a couple of times by Phone & got the cars details for the Federal Elan Sprint register. Glad to hear that it will be back on the road after so long!

Hope to see it & you in Princeton this summer
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PostPost by: gjz30075 » Wed Apr 27, 2016 3:40 pm

There's a Federal Elan Sprint Register??? Phil, are you the registrar? What info do you need from me?
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PostPost by: CBUEB1771 » Wed Apr 27, 2016 8:04 pm

tedtaylor wrote:i am missing all the hardware fasteners! This scares me since i much preferred to have original nuts and bolts and from their original locations.


Ted,
This is no problem at all unless you want bolts from the original manufacturer, usually GKN. The Service Parts List covers all of the fasteners in adequate detail including the preface which shows you how to decode the part numbers into diameter, length, pitch and head style for all but the few that are special items. Really the only special bolts are at the outboard end of the wishbone. These have a reduced height head for clearance to the wheel rim and are available from RD Enterprises and others. I don't use Grade 8 fasteners, I prefer aircraft hardware from suppliers such as Pegasus where they are available for about the same price as Grade 5 items from your local hardware store. If you have questions you will get plenty of answers here, don't hesitate to PM me. I have a new chassis going together in the basement and can measure things for you with ease.
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PostPost by: tedtaylor » Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:39 pm

Thanks Russ for the source information and the offer of assistance. I may take you up on that!

Today i "re-arranged" the garage. It's sort of like "Lotus Elan Central" (no reference to the M100 site), since I have three Elans in a two car garage. It's easier since Lotus are such small cars. I placed it at the back of the garage cross-ways and jacked up both the front and rear ends, so the car is up high on jack stands to easily work on just about every possible area of the car.
rear-diff-001.jpg and


Surprisingly, I got a call from my mechanic working on the rear and he asked that I come to the shop to talk about what he found. Uh oh, now i figure somethings up. I get to the shop and he has it all taken apart on the bench. We found the bolts attaching the crown ring were all loose, with one backed out enough that it ground down and scored the housing, leaving metal filings in the gear oil and metal shavings in the bearings.
rear-diff-002.jpg and

rear-diff-003.jpg and

The pinion shaft bearing was fouled with the debris enough to cause the stuck, locked condition. So the last person to have been inside the rear didn't put it back together with proper torque or loctite. Otherwise the pinion and crown ring showed no signs of uneven wear, so I made a list of the parts needed to rebuild (bearings, seals, gasket, bolts, magnetic plug, gear oil, etc.) and sent the list to RDent for filling.
Last edited by tedtaylor on Thu Apr 28, 2016 2:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPost by: john1180 » Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:51 am

One of Dave Beans other companies is Bon Aero, a great aircraft hardware supplier!
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PostPost by: CBUEB1771 » Thu Apr 28, 2016 7:23 pm

tedtaylor wrote:Yes, it came with generator and the original owner changed it out for the alternator. The generator and regulator box came with the car by way of extra parts in boxes. He said he switched to the alternator and removed the regulator box and rewired it as such.


This got me thinking because a federal +2 of that year would certainly have been fitted with an alternator as original equipment. Interestingly the Elan Service Parts List only shows a generator for all years and series. The schematic diagrams in the Elan Workshop Manual similarly show only a generator/regulator arrangement for S1 through S4. However Section M.10 of the Workshop Manual covers installation of the Lucas 17 ACR alternator as an upgrade to handle heavier electrical demand. So your alternator, which looks like a Lucas ACR series, is a perfectly legitimate period modification supported by Lotus. I would not rush to put the generator and regulator back in. Remember that if you are really driven by originality you will need to reinstall the cross-over tubing between the inlet and exhaust manifolds plus the secondary throttles for preheating of the air-fuel mixture!

I also note that your engine is canted over as it would need to with a Weber style cylinder head and Weber carburetors. At some point a Weber configuration engine mount was installed on the inlet side of your engine. This type of engine mount elevates the engine on the inlet side. Stromberg carbureted engines do not need to be canted over and should have the same engine mount on both inlet and exhaust sides (026 E 6011).
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PostPost by: tedtaylor » Thu Apr 28, 2016 8:24 pm

Russ, you found things I was unaware of, and/or blind to. Indeed the motor mounts are like you said, the carb side is higher for a Weber carbed engine. So i double checked the engine block number and it does indeed match the VIN plate. Then i peeked behind the cam covers by the firewall, and lo and behold, the head is cut out for the cam shaft extension for a drive pulley. So we now know this was a Europa HEAD placed on the original engine block. So although I have a "matching numbers" car, the head apparently has been changed out.

My question for the group is were any Federal Elan Sprints originally equipped with Webers ? I thought all Fed cars were equipped with Strombergs to meet Fed emission standards?

I could just cry. :cry:
engine-002.jpg and

block stamped "T27344"
engine-001.jpg and

VIN plate stamped "T/27344"
engine-003.jpg and

the Europa Stromberg head w/ camshaft opening "plugged up"
TED
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PostPost by: CBUEB1771 » Thu Apr 28, 2016 9:17 pm

Ted,
I suppose that could be a Europa head, the casting seems to be extended rearward a bit where the longer inlet cam would poke through to drive the alternator. But all TC heads have the half-moon plugs at the rear behind both cams. There should be a letter stamp on the top of the head on one of the round bosses near the spark plug wells. That might resolve the question of origin. All federal Elans post-1968 had Strombergs. I don't think you have anything to cry about yet. Having a Weber-type engine mount on the inlet side is indicative of nothing. It would have been very easy to replace an engine mount with the wrong one. You also have a Stromberg-style bonnet and many of the other federal emissions control bits like the little activated carbon canister that is supposed to clean up air vented from the fuel tank. Everything about 0297K suggests that a Stromberg head was the original fitment.
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PostPost by: The Veg » Thu Apr 28, 2016 9:58 pm

OK, time for the n00b question: why do Weber- equipped engines need to be canted?
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PostPost by: CBUEB1771 » Fri Apr 29, 2016 2:41 am

The Veg wrote:OK, time for the n00b question: why do Weber- equipped engines need to be canted?


In an Elan, Weber carburetors will touch the top of the inner wheel housing if the engine is not canted over to increase vertical clearance. Strombergs clear if the engine is level, meaning same engine mount on both sides. This is not an issue for the +2 where either type of carburetor clears the inner wheel well with the engine level.
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PostPost by: pharriso » Fri Apr 29, 2016 8:33 am

tedtaylor wrote:My question for the group is were any Federal Elan Sprints originally equipped with Webers ?


No they weren't....

tedtaylor wrote: I thought all Fed cars were equipped with Strombergs to meet Fed emission standards?


Correct
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