Lotus Elan

Getting OGU roadworthy again

PostPost by: billwill » Tue Sep 11, 2012 11:06 pm

661 wrote:That looks amazing.
Dare I ask...............If a QED head costs 'x' , and 'x' is not a binary digit, how many 'x' is that



Including VAT, which is a right killer nowadays at 20% the head cost me a few thousand hundred more in numeric pounds than I paid for the whole car in 1969.

And I paid ?1100 for my car in 1969.

But if you fancy having one, you should ask for a quote from Tim, because the price might vary depending on exactly what machining you want done.


~~~~~~

QED website shows their head at ?2275+VAT = ? 2730 so the SAS head is a bit more expensive.
Last edited by billwill on Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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PostPost by: billwill » Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:00 pm

How is the temperature sensor of the non-electric temperature gauge supposed to come out of the steel housing screwed into the head.

Over the years I've tried many times to get it out without success and regrettably today's effort seems to have cracked the tube or bulb, because I can see damp and smell alcohol. :x :cry:

It looks as if it should just pull out once the brass cap nut is undone, but no way does mine come out It's as if some earlier engine mechanic, glued it in with araldite.
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PostPost by: types26/36 » Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:03 pm

billwill wrote:How is the temperature sensor of the non-electric temperature gauge supposed to come out of the steel housing screwed into the head.
It looks as if it should just pull out once the brass cap nut is undone, but no way does mine come out


Correct....but the "bulb" sticks in the fitting if it has not been out in a long time, you should use a thin spanner to hold the fitting then unscrew the brass nut. If you do not hold the fitting and only turn the brass nut then the fitting turns in the head breaking the tube.
You will also see from the pic that bulb has two flats on it to hold or move it slightly.
I normally add a little copperslip inside the fitting and to the nut threads.
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PostPost by: billwill » Mon Sep 17, 2012 1:06 am

Hmmm, that's what I thought, but it simply will not come out of my housing. I have become master of the skill of arranging the capillary tube in a single wide loop and then unscrewing carefully the whole housing and fitting from the head. Since there is about 3 foot of capillary tube it is just able to take the twist without breaking.

Then to put it back, I first arrange the tube in a single wide loop, then twist gently the fitting in the opposite direction & then screw it in (with PTFE tape on it) thus allowing the tub to untwist & then twist slightly in the forward direction.
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PostPost by: elansprint71 » Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:47 am

Bill,
Last time I took mine out there was a similar problem. By using Plus Gas, leaving overnight and then a gentle left-right motion with a spanner on the flats, it eventually eased out. It looked like there had been some reaction between the dissimilar metals but you could be correct about the use of sealant by your DPO.
Sounds like yours may be goosed now, so you might as well remove the whole fitting and clean the bore up ready to receive the new unit. I found a complete recon gauge etc on e-bay a few months ago; about 60 quid, from memory. It actually looks brand-new.

Good Luck.
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PostPost by: billwill » Mon Sep 17, 2012 5:55 pm

elansprint71 wrote:Bill,
Last time I took mine out there was a similar problem. By using Plus Gas, leaving overnight and then a gentle left-right motion with a spanner on the flats, it eventually eased out. It looked like there had been some reaction between the dissimilar metals but you could be correct about the use of sealant by your DPO.
Sounds like yours may be goosed now, so you might as well remove the whole fitting and clean the bore up ready to receive the new unit. I found a complete recon gauge etc on e-bay a few months ago; about 60 quid, from memory. It actually looks brand-new.

Good Luck.


Frustrating, really, this was a new/recon Temp/oil-pressure unit put in only about 10 years ago.

The bulb-housing is off the head at present in any case, because it was taken out as above, for the analysis of the head crack 3-4 years ago (when the head was declared dead and I started saving for the brand new one described above). It was when I was cleaning it up yesterday preparing for fitting the new head that I knackered it. If I can get the bulb out fairly intact I might be able to refill & solder it myself. I've seen a description somewhere on the net of how to do that.


Not exactly a "DPO" as the only previous owner was Malcolm Ricketts, but perhaps a firm that I had do some repair work that 10 years ago had a JAMM (junior apprentice motor mechanic) who put the sensor into the housing, without considering all aspects..
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PostPost by: billwill » Mon Sep 17, 2012 6:03 pm

Next question.

I've ordered some new flexible brake pipes and I see from the pictures that they have banjo fittings.

I don't recall banjo fittings on my brake callipers (I'm going to go crawling on the floor real soon to check), and looking at my two versions of the service manual, the first manual shows banjos and the second later manual shows pipes that screw straight in.

I've never noticed any discussion about the matter before so maybe it is not a serious issue.

So the question is: do the brake callipers accept either banjo or straight pipes or are there different versions of the callipers for the two types of pipe?
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PostPost by: UAB807F » Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:27 pm

I don't think it's a problem Bill.

I've had both banjo & straight connections on my rear calipers. I tend to use either method dependent on the best route for the particular hose length. Personally I try to do without extra fittings purely on the principle of fewer joints in the system to check, but wouldn't let that prejudice override a neater routing solution.

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PostPost by: billwill » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:52 pm

I checked my front brakes this evening and they do have banjos, so presumably the rear have too and Brian says either would fit, so there was no problem anyway.
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PostPost by: billwill » Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:59 pm

billwill wrote:
elansprint71 wrote:Bill,
Last time I took mine out there was a similar problem. By using Plus Gas, leaving overnight and then a gentle left-right motion with a spanner on the flats, it eventually eased out. It looked like there had been some reaction between the dissimilar metals but you could be correct about the use of sealant by your DPO.
Sounds like yours may be goosed now, so you might as well remove the whole fitting and clean the bore up ready to receive the new unit. I found a complete recon gauge etc on e-bay a few months ago; about 60 quid, from memory. It actually looks brand-new.

Good Luck.


Frustrating, really, this was a new/recon Temp/oil-pressure unit put in only about 10 years ago.

The bulb-housing is off the head at present in any case, because it was taken out as above, for the analysis of the head crack 3-4 years ago (when the head was declared dead and I started saving for the brand new one described above). It was when I was cleaning it up yesterday preparing for fitting the new head that I knackered it. If I can get the bulb out fairly intact I might be able to refill & solder it myself. I've seen a description somewhere on the net of how to do that.


Not exactly a "DPO" as the only previous owner was Malcolm Ricketts, but perhaps a firm that I had do some repair work that 10 years ago had a JAMM (junior apprentice motor mechanic) who put the sensor into the housing, without considering all aspects..


Despite trying a blowlamp and heating the sensor housing until the gauge read 212 deg F and later trying putting it in a mixture of ice & water & salt, nothing so far has at all loosened the sensor bulb. The brass collar of the bulb is now drastically grunged due to using a mole wrench to grip it and a large spanner on the housing. Even using what I consider extreme torque, the bulb would not budge in the housing.

Does anyone know how thick is the metal of the bulb? It looks like brass, but I expect it is quite thin and I suspect that any attempt to press it out will just collapse the bulb.
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Tue Sep 18, 2012 4:10 am

Sounds like the adapter is seriiously stuck :cry:

I would soak for a few days in penetrant solution
Then I would mount the adaptor or the sensor compression nut in a vice.
Then heat on the nut and loctite freeze spray on the adapter
Then a big spanner or pipe wrench on the part not in the vice and some sharp hits on the spanner with a large hammer to break it free
If it still does not work then more hits and more torque until it gives up - eventually it will.

The adapter is easily replaced so destroy that if you have to in the process ! it was orginally aluminium ( at least it was on my S4) so if yours is steel that may be contributing to your problem.

The bulb is relatively thin and anyhow you cant press it out of the adapter until you separate the adapter and compression nut which lock it in place.

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PostPost by: elansprint71 » Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:18 am

Bill,
Can you show us a photograph? From what you have written I cannot visualise if the bulb is stuck in the fitting or is detached and stuck in the thermo-housing of the head.
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PostPost by: billwill » Tue Sep 18, 2012 11:56 am

rgh0 wrote:Sounds like the adapter is seriiously stuck :cry:

I would soak for a few days in penetrant solution
Then I would mount the adaptor or the sensor compression nut in a vice.
Then heat on the nut and loctite freeze spray on the adapter
Then a big spanner or pipe wrench on the part not in the vice and some sharp hits on the spanner with a large hammer to break it free
If it still does not work then more hits and more torque until it gives up - eventually it will.

The adapter is easily replaced so destroy that if you have to in the process ! it was orginally aluminium ( at least it was on my S4) so if yours is steel that may be contributing to your problem.

The bulb is relatively thin and anyhow you cant press it out of the adapter until you separate the adapter and compression nut which lock it in place.

cheers
Rohan.



The brass cap nut is not a problem (i think that is what you call the compression nut) that unscrews easily.

I'll do a photo later today.
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PostPost by: Matt Elan » Tue Sep 18, 2012 12:31 pm

Re cost of heads - QED website says ?2275 inc VAT for a bare head, Burton catalogue says ?3700.....
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Tue Sep 18, 2012 2:20 pm

OK so the bulb is stuck in the adapter and the compression nut is released. Then I would just cut the adapter until I can split it to release the bulb

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