Lotus Elan

hopeful of buying Elan +2 but sill damage

PostPost by: Marc13 » Fri Aug 14, 2020 7:06 pm

Another question:

Is there a discernible difference when driving a 108 bhp older car compared to a +2s 126 bhp? I have only drove 2 +2s....assuming they are both in good condition?

Thanks
Marc13
New-tral
 
Posts: 10
Joined: 06 Aug 2020
Location: Leicster

PostPost by: vincereynard » Fri Aug 14, 2020 7:38 pm

If you peruse the road test reports you will see little difference over the years. The reason for this is the Chunky (or Arnold) cheated with the first ones and had an Expert Engineering 130 BHP engine it.

Hence , when they had a later more powerful motor, performance stayed much the same in the Road Tests!

Probably a most accurate guesstimate for the early cars would be by using the figures from early American tests. Still Webers but standard. These show a top speed of about 110 and 0 > 60 around 9.5secs.
about what you would expect compared to a Lotus Cortina with the same engine. Or an Elan with an additional 300lbs.
vincereynard
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 1232
Joined: 12 Jan 2015
Location: amersham

PostPost by: Marc13 » Sat Aug 15, 2020 8:32 am

vincereynard wrote:If you peruse the road test reports you will see little difference over the years. The reason for this is the Chunky (or Arnold) cheated with the first ones and had an Expert Engineering 130 BHP engine it.

Hence , when they had a later more powerful motor, performance stayed much the same in the Road Tests!

Probably a most accurate guesstimate for the early cars would be by using the figures from early American tests. Still Webers but standard. These show a top speed of about 110 and 0 > 60 around 9.5secs.
about what you would expect compared to a Lotus Cortina with the same engine. Or an Elan with an additional 300lbs.

Thanks Vince - just making sure I am understanding this correctly. The early models said to have 108 BHP, actually had quite a bit more than this?
Marc13
New-tral
 
Posts: 10
Joined: 06 Aug 2020
Location: Leicster

PostPost by: rgh0 » Sat Aug 15, 2020 9:00 am

Marc13 wrote:
vincereynard wrote:If you peruse the road test reports you will see little difference over the years. The reason for this is the Chunky (or Arnold) cheated with the first ones and had an Expert Engineering 130 BHP engine it.

Hence , when they had a later more powerful motor, performance stayed much the same in the Road Tests!

Probably a most accurate guesstimate for the early cars would be by using the figures from early American tests. Still Webers but standard. These show a top speed of about 110 and 0 > 60 around 9.5secs.
about what you would expect compared to a Lotus Cortina with the same engine. Or an Elan with an additional 300lbs.

Thanks Vince - just making sure I am understanding this correctly. The early models said to have 108 BHP, actually had quite a bit more than this?


The models that Lotus used as magazine review road test cars in the UK had more power due to modified engines. The sold to the public Plus 2 road cars had the normal SE engine.

cheers
Rohan
User avatar
rgh0
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 7600
Joined: 22 Sep 2003
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPost by: vincereynard » Sat Aug 15, 2020 10:09 am

Marc,

I "believe" that the first +2s were actually fitted with 118BHP SE engine - as Rohan mentioned. So not a vast difference twixt that and the "nominal" 126 BHP Big Valve. The BV engine was more marketing ploy than a big power boost. Once again I think that the difference was very small increase in the inlet valve diameter. Most extra power came from a skimmed head and "D" spec cams.

Wiser historians will no doubt comfirm or deny. It was not unknown for Lotus Road Test cars to be delivered with a strangely defective bonnet release. Allegedly.
vincereynard
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 1232
Joined: 12 Jan 2015
Location: amersham

PostPost by: wotsisname » Sat Aug 15, 2020 11:06 am

Assuming you find a car with somewhere near it's original power output.and running as it should.. its my understanding that the earlier cars are a bit lighter... certainly a less plush interior,etc. I also believe the smaller valved engines will feel torquier at the lower end, with the big valves giving a stronger top end.
1968 Elan plus 2 - project
2007 Elise S2 [modified with a Hethel 70th sticker (yellow)]
2000 Elise S1 - Sold
wotsisname
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 466
Joined: 24 Jun 2015
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

PostPost by: Donels » Sat Aug 15, 2020 5:16 pm

According to Tony Rudd’s book the power went from 105 bhp to 128 bhp with the big valve engine.
Elan +2
Elise mk 1
Donels
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 348
Joined: 10 Sep 2016
Location: Tamworth

PostPost by: alan.barker » Sun Aug 16, 2020 6:34 am

I have owned a 1968 +2, a 1970+2S and a 1973+2S130/4 and i have found no difference in driving them . For sure there is the difference on paper 108 bhp, 118 bhp and 126 bhp imho that's only for Bar chat with a Beer.
The most important is if the Engine is set up correctly.
My favourite was the 1970 +2S with lots of little Lights even in the Ashtrays and Puddle Lights on bottom of Doors. Plus lots of Fuse Boxes.
Just go for one with Lotus Chassis/Subframe and as original as possible.
Good luck in you search
Alan
Alan.b Brittany 1972 elan sprint fhc Lagoon Blue 0460E
alan.barker
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 2464
Joined: 06 Dec 2008
Location: BRITTANY FRANCE

PostPost by: XR40 » Sun Aug 16, 2020 5:28 pm

Marc, just a thought, you could always try and find an early +2 with an 'H' type Super SE engine. High compression, D type cams, 123 BHP.
Might be a nice alternative to the standard SE engine.
XR40
New-tral
 
Posts: 7
Joined: 26 May 2017
Location: Carmarthenshire

PostPost by: Chrispy » Sun Aug 16, 2020 10:56 pm

Donels wrote:According to Tony Rudd’s book the power went from 105 bhp to 128 bhp with the big valve engine.


My understanding was the original +2 had the 118hp motor with webers and the C type cam. I didn't think it was ever fitted with the base Twincam.
Chris
Elan +2 #0245
Exige S2 Supercharged
Chrispy
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 317
Joined: 29 Oct 2017
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPost by: Matt Elan » Wed Aug 19, 2020 4:33 pm

All my research agrees with Rohan and Chrispy - the Plus 2 was always offered with the 118 hp SE spec engine, certainly in UK and non-Federal markets. Data in Miles Wilkins book seems to agree, but he does not identify the Serial prefix 'I' 1969 Federal Plus 2 with Strombergs as being S/E spec.
Matthew Vale - Classic Motoring Author
1968 Plus 2 - Somewhat cosmetically and mechanically modified
1969 Plus 2S - Currently undergoing nut and bolt restoration
Visit me on matthewvale.com
User avatar
Matt Elan
Fourth Gear
Fourth Gear
 
Posts: 578
Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Location: Fleet, Hants, UK

PostPost by: alan.barker » Thu Aug 20, 2020 6:27 am

My 1968 +2 cam no groove.
My 1970 +2S cam 1 groove.
My 1973 +2S 130 cam 2 grooves.
My 1972 Sprint cam 2 grooves.
Alan
Alan.b Brittany 1972 elan sprint fhc Lagoon Blue 0460E
alan.barker
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 2464
Joined: 06 Dec 2008
Location: BRITTANY FRANCE

PostPost by: gibbon » Thu Aug 20, 2020 10:08 am

I would not judge the performance from the badge on the back of the car, all the plus 2's i drove varied hugely in drive.

Judge the car by driving it and dont get hung up on numbers, mine is an early model +2 and goes very, very well, with sprint spec cams and lightly ported heads, all the engines at this point will have been changed from original spec / tolerance by now anyway.
gibbon
Second Gear
Second Gear
 
Posts: 51
Joined: 16 Jan 2015
Location: UK

PostPost by: MarkDa » Fri Aug 21, 2020 11:53 pm

Late to the thread but apparently it's been sold.
Perhaps to the regular who buys something every year and brings it back so it can be sold again at the same price?
MarkDa
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 1234
Joined: 15 Apr 2017
Location: Stroud
Previous

Total Online:

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests