document reliability

[twincamman]

OK ?much has been said about records and posession of them ??first Lotus has no record of what cars from the race department were shipped, built or how they were equipped . Why? BECAUSE the records were allegedly removed from the factory illegally?and once a record has been compromised it has no value . The thief who stole the records commited an unlawful act and now he /she and said documents have no creditabilty .Car company documents are not given away to anyone , they are destroyed. Said document is now of no value as it can be exposed to tampering and changes at the possessors desire . [and with 200 k pounds a car the desire is no doubt pretty great ] second... to accept the stolen documents authenticity as vouched for by the possesser of the document MAY be accepting the word of someone in possession of a stolen and tampered document or a dishonest person .I have heard it all ' found in trash ;,,,',passed on by an enthusiast? ?'found in a shipped car? .'.look its on the same yellow paper '?every lie that can be fabricated to get your money .all accepted by the weak minded or enthusiastic eager buyer Am I a skeptic?you bet and I worked in the auto industry 20 years so Im aware just how careful they are with paper work .If your in the market for a 26 R you should be twice as careful of fraudulent documents presented as fact as their possesion is illegal .ed

[bigvalvehead]

Morning Ed

Where did your info re the removal of the records come from??

Do you have any hard evidence for any of the claims you make? ie LHD 26R production records?

I have spoken at length with Peter Pulver over lunch and he confirms many of the facts re the 26R's he imported

WHAT DO YOU ACTUALLY KNOW FOR A FACT ED?

The 1st 26R to leave the factory left on 25/2/64 (not 63 as you regularly say) The last 26R S2 left on 23/7/66 much later than you say again.

I KNOW at least 3 people with a list that details information regarding the correct chassis nos for all the 26R?s produced both Series 1 which had chassis numbers in the format 26-R-* and the series 2 cars which had chassis numbers in the format 26-S2-* note in the series 2 chassis number there is NO R involved whatsoever. All these lists mysteriously have the same information which would lead most people to conclude they were not compiled ad hoc.

The list was actually compiled from the original cards that were used by the production dept.
These cards have been confirmed as being the same as used for the 23B production by the current archivist.
see att'd pic
Peter Broad was the archivist during the 80's and the list I have has been taken directly from the cards and hand written by him.

So where exactly does that leave us with 26R-s2-33 which is a left hand drive race elan with a nonconforming chassis number, a Shapecraft body,(I THINK NOT!) and many parts that racers in the day fitted to all manner and make of race cars. The car in question claims to have been manufactured in 1964 and my list (and the other lists by coincidence? ) happen to place the genuine 26-S2-33 as having been manufactured in 1965.

I think that your constant whinging regarding anything to do with 26R?s, Shapecrafts, the money someone chooses to pay for the correct oil warning light etc etc should end.

You should drive your car and enjoy it.

Let other people who are interested in the history and whereabouts of these fantastic vehicles have their say without unnecessary bitching.

Dave Hughes

[elanfan1]

Reposted from the other thread as it's relevant here too:

Dave,

What is interesting in that document is the misspelling of Duchess as Dutchess. If these documents were faked you'd make damned sure that it was spelt correctly. You can picture someone reading out the cards for Peter to transcribe and you'd probably spell Duchess as Dutchess as they sound exactly the same.

Irrelevant? Probably!

Steve

[trw99]

Steve

The form does show the correct spelling for Dutchess Autos. Here is a period shot of Peter Pulver in one of his 26Rs. Also look at the period US Lotus adverts for additional confirmation.

Tim

[elanfan1]

Learning all zer time!

[twincamman]

Hi Dave all your questions about my car and others are discussed at length Garys thread in 26R so there is no need to hashthings over again MY car has no chassis number but s the info on the rear fire wall perhaps you can answer a question for me . Who built the chineese eye bodys for Lotus ?? NOW AS TO RECORDS ?..
Try to write to Ford requesting ORIGINAL production records for say ?.the GT40 ?..see what you get ??.these documents are just not public ??you can request info on a specific car and you will get a letter ??so some one who clims to have factory production records must have obtained them in a questioable way . I have an e mail on this subject but it borders on liable so I will not publish it ?the car loooks really good ..drive safely ..ed

[bigvalvehead]

26-R-9 back in its Sebring 65 livery complete with roof light and door lights as well as original stickers.

[twincamman]

A message to my biggest FAN ?.you are on my ignore list so your warm and fuzzy thoughts and wishes go unread ?thanks ////ed

[oldchieft]

A message to my biggest FAN ?.you are on my ignore list so your warm and fuzzy thoughts and wishes go unread ?thanks ////ed

How does an ignore list work?

Jon the Chief

[twincamman]

It works very well ....thanks for asking

[twincamman]

Well Dave you have pretty well supported my argument .... If the records were removed from the factory or if they were "compiled" by nonfactory persons or factory persons the information is suspect . Confusion makes many things simpler ...ed

[bigvalvehead]

Ed you are on a different planet (most of the time by the sound of it).

You are welcome to speculate all you like.

I think that from now on I shall treat you like a mushroom but I think you are already full of B******T.

Cheers
Dave

[twincamman]

Such a defensive come back for a simple statement ......so who built the Chinese eye body's for Lotus ,any idea?

[Spyder fan]

Please stop baiting Ed over the authenticity of his 26R ?lan. LHD or not, it's plain to me and many others in the know that his car is genuinely one of the 350 surviving examples of the 139 cars originally built by the factory.

Most people go to the trouble of trying to fake a car, but Ed bought one that was genuine that lacked authenticity.

I hope this puts an end to this shameful vilification of an upstanding and respected member of our worldwide and largely tolerant web forums.

FAO Jeff Cocking:
Can we put an end to these stupid ramblings? It's really peeing me off big time and there's a whole raft of others on here sick of this rubbish.

[elanfan1]

Speak your mind don't hold back!