Lotus Elan

Historic Rallying

PostPost by: Rozzer » Mon Jun 02, 2014 12:14 am

Morning all,

As the title suggests, I'm thinking about getting the Elan prepped for historic rallying, largely so I have a motorsport in which my wife can participate (probably to start with as navigator); before you have hysterics (pardon the pun!) about using my car for unintended purposes, I am talking about tarmac-based, navigational and problem-solving events, not thrashing the poor old girl through the forests at night (mind you, that could be fun - with the car too :))

As I am at the very start of thinking about this, I really only have an end goal in mind which is, in due course, to take the car over to Europe (perhaps doing the Sydney-London) and do some of the "classics", such as The Malts (and possibly even GOME) as part of exploring Europe with Mrs R; but in the short term, I am really after anyone's experience of local (ideally NSW, but also Victorian or Queensland) events. Clearly the car has to be prepped and reliable, which goes without saying, so I have some work to do to upgrade the seatbelts from single sash to harness, fit a roll-hoop, Brantz, fire extinguisher etc. If there is other stuff (sump bash plates for example) that you have undertaken, I'd like to hear about it.

So if anyone has participated in these sort of events, I'd be most grateful for your views, thoughts and input. And if anyone else is thinking about this form of motorsport, I'd be interested to discuss :)
Ashton
1950 AJS 350M
1956 Lotus Eleven S1 (Tuft's car)
1964 Lotus Elan S2 26/4177
1998 Lotus Elise S1
2003 Mini Cooper S R53
2013 BMW 118d Conv
If you aren't living on the edge, you're taking up too much space
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PostPost by: vstibbard » Mon Jun 02, 2014 3:54 am

We helped prepare Graham Vaughan's Elan for Targa Tasmania Ashton, happy to show you what we did.

V
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PostPost by: Rozzer » Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:17 am

Thanks Vaughan - when can you make a coffee?!! Joking aside, let me know when you are free and I'd happily buy you a coffee or beer in return for your thoughts...and the roll hoop manufacturer :)
Ashton
1950 AJS 350M
1956 Lotus Eleven S1 (Tuft's car)
1964 Lotus Elan S2 26/4177
1998 Lotus Elise S1
2003 Mini Cooper S R53
2013 BMW 118d Conv
If you aren't living on the edge, you're taking up too much space
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:18 am

Patrick in Queensland ( Elandoc on the forum here) rallies his Elan, worth talking to him also

cheers
Rohan
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PostPost by: Rozzer » Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:21 am

Thanks Rohan, I'll drop him a PM....
Ashton
1950 AJS 350M
1956 Lotus Eleven S1 (Tuft's car)
1964 Lotus Elan S2 26/4177
1998 Lotus Elise S1
2003 Mini Cooper S R53
2013 BMW 118d Conv
If you aren't living on the edge, you're taking up too much space
Rozzer
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PostPost by: gherlt » Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:36 am

Hi,
let her sign a document in which she resigns to apply for divorce because of rallying ....
And ... you sign that, too. Basically you give control over the rally to her, you only drive. So be prepared for fights and periods of unwelcome silence.

Regarding preparation of the car. The car should be fit, in healthy conditions, no just a good driver.
Especially the drivetrain and it's opposition, the brakes. Otherwise the lights, if you don't install additional lights, install some of the Osram/Philips Nightscreamer or whatever bulbs, which give a certain plus of lumens over standard ones. Its noticeable. If you drive by night, you must consider additional lights. Unless you are lunatic, like me.

I didn't install rollover nothing, and we drive without seatbelts. It's historic rallying, although sometimes you go fast to catch up, it's not about going fast. If you have fears, change car to a Mercedes Benz.

Equipment: Brantz or similar, piramide, clock (not necessary a radio controlled one, if you drive by night, it should have retroilumination, I use circuit-innovations.co.uk, nice but does stop on power out), stop watches, interior light (should iluminate the passengers thighs, not blind the driver)
I usually take some replacement parts with me, basically the simple stuff which a garage does not have any more, regarding ignition basically, bulbs, some small fixing stuff, silencing (silver) tape, cord, electrical stuff, the spray for the tires, 1 litre of oil, some brake fluid. A towing cord (it should be light).
Something to ly on, to eat (potatoes), to drink (water, double use with car), not to fall asleep (bubble gum, cold tea), not get blind (sunglasses (does not apply to UK)), first aid kit, triangles, some tools, especially for changing tires.
As a backup, I take with me some printed speed tables.
That's it. That is enough for 100 to 1500 km rallying.
Enjoy. And don't take too serious.
1964 S1 (engine ready, awainting body paint)
1967 S3 DHC (now adjusted by Brian Buckland, totally calm idle)
1969 S4 FHC (final interior stuff)
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PostPost by: Rozzer » Mon Jun 02, 2014 7:42 am

Thank you! A concise precis of the prep required :) Not sure about your choice of emergency food supplies (raw potato not being my favourite) but I think I can work around that. And the impending divorce proceedings :)

On the subject of Brantz, which model from their somewhat daunting array is the go - I am used to using the International Pro 2, but there are all sorts of others on their site - any recommendations out there? I'm thinking the 2S as it has a reliable speedo (which is more than can be said for the OEM :) ) but I'd apprecaite any thoughts on the subject.....
Ashton
1950 AJS 350M
1956 Lotus Eleven S1 (Tuft's car)
1964 Lotus Elan S2 26/4177
1998 Lotus Elise S1
2003 Mini Cooper S R53
2013 BMW 118d Conv
If you aren't living on the edge, you're taking up too much space
Rozzer
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Joined: 14 Oct 2013
Location: St Peters, Sydney, Australia

PostPost by: jimj » Mon Jun 02, 2014 8:28 am

Though not very local to you, we do/have done lots of this sort of thing. This is a useful read; http://www.heroevents.eu/Events/Howtogo ... rRallying/ . I don`t know if the regulations are the same for you. We use a Brantz International 2, you can use a Retrotrip or Halda, and 2 stopwatches plus another watch for rally time, and, occasionally, speed tables, that`s it.
In Europe they allow all sorts of electronic speed calculation with, even, beepers like parking sensors to count you down to the timing point. It doesn`t seem right to me, that you can buy electronics to replace ability. It`s just not British, don`t y`know. I`m surprised no-one there has connected their laptop to a cruise control.
Many such rallies are called "Reliability Trials", Scottish Malts for one, so regarding car prep. for the sort of thing you`re talking about, reliability, obviously, is key. Each organiser lists required equipment, 2kg fire extinguisher, first aid kit, etc. some beyond that required by the MSA or your national body, e.g. spill kits, ground sheets for parking in posh places, and so on.
Beyond that, you`re not talking about stage rallying with sump guards, roll cages, full harnesses and helmets.
Just make sure your car works and keeps working, pay your money and do it.
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PostPost by: gherlt » Mon Jun 02, 2014 1:38 pm

I use a Brantz International 2s pro, for first calibration it is quite useful, in combination with a GPS, comparing the two on a long strech, you can adjust the Brantz to +-1%.
I use the Brantz because I use a retrotrip in Germany (no electroncs allowed in some rallies), and they have nice conectors for interchanging tripmeters and cars. And they have nice red skirts.
Otherwise, if I had the money, I would go the way Pistacchio sprint 72 goes, interconnected piramide and tripmeter,
very good thing.
See here: lotus-elan-f19/international-regularity-rally-and-june-t31420.html

If I never would participate in an "oldfashioned" rallye ("no electronics") I would definitevely go with Rallymeter (App for Apple) and their sensor. Very good piramide, easy programming, no hieroglyphics, clear display. Cheap. 129 EUR. There is only one "but": the sensor is proprietary. (Brantz, Halda, etc, all have the same sensor type).
And installation is not as easy as Brantz speedo cable or gearbox sensor.
1964 S1 (engine ready, awainting body paint)
1967 S3 DHC (now adjusted by Brian Buckland, totally calm idle)
1969 S4 FHC (final interior stuff)
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PostPost by: 7skypilot » Tue Jun 03, 2014 1:42 pm

My wife and I do some very gentle UK and Europe road rallying in our S4 Coupe. It's been very gently modified to make it more 'user friendly' but I've not added a cage etc. so it really isn't crash-proof at all. Having spent many years on 'bikes I'd rather drive more gently and keep on the road!!!

We chose a Monit Q10 rally trip computer largely because of its small size and very clear display which, unlike the Brantz, does not require shading in sunlight. The Monit counts wheel rotation electronically. It may be outlawed by a small minority of very specialist events but the Q10 has no facility for GPS or average speed and so offers no advantage over a Halda or Branz except for its size, which really does compliment the Elan. I drilled the front brake disc shield to mount the sensor and the wiring is almost unnoticeable. The display unit is mounted on the glove box lid. It's also very, very easy to use and adjust.

Ground clearance is a problem, and I spent a lot of time (and dosh!) 'burying' the main exhaust pipe as close to the spine of the chassis as possible (with Zircotec heat insulation for chassis protection). The silencer was also tucked up very close to the boot floor, and the four-into-two (stainless from Matty) reworked to maximise ground clearance at the front. Using Norma stainless 'jubilee-type' clips instead of the traditional 'U' connectors on the system also increases clearance. Its worth heat-shielding the clutch slave and clutch fork rubber at the same time. Adjustable platforms front and rear (both TT) allow clearance, and corner weight, to be adjusted. Stronger springs, 1.9" front 120'lb and 2.25" rear 100'lb ('fast road') also help without giving too hard a ride.

We have a Spyder 'harness bar' which mounts pretty simply, and unobtrusively, over the suspension turrets and under the parcel shelf. This allows the Willans harness to be mounted rather more directly. The original look (and fragility) of the Elan is pretty much unchanged. Elise mark 1 seats fit well, offer more comfort and a head restraint. They're easily removable to reinstall the original seats.

I've changed the lovely, but rather delicate, steel wheels for Minilites. As with all things Elan, they took some time to fit and required rear A-frame and (minor) wheel arch fettling to fit. They're strong, have a 'period' look and offer good choice of tyres. The originals are kept for Sunday best.

Clocks etc. are pretty standard, but fitting them into the confines of the Elan is difficult. Perhaps the ash tray is a convenient and unobtrusive place to bolt them to? Velcro attachments just seem to shake off! I have one stopwatch fitted on a bracket attached to the large dashboard fixing Phillips screw between tach and speedo. I've seen speed table attached to the spokes of the steering wheel with 'bulldog' clips. Anything goes!

As other worthy contributors have said, a car built for reliability removes the necessity to carry many spares. I have a coil (fixed in position for quick changeover) and the usual selection of spares in the boot. I intend to install some strong fixing points in the cab and boot so everything can be really securely strapped down. It never ends...

Enjoy the car!
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PostPost by: jimj » Tue Jun 03, 2014 1:55 pm

The stop watches have clips and I attach these to a piece of aluminium angle drilled so the demister vent screws hold it in place. In the driver`s sight line, just above the trip and easily seen by driver and navigator.
Jim
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PostPost by: casalunge » Wed Jun 04, 2014 8:04 am

Consider the Pirelli Classic Marathon
Very professional organisation, superb routes.
We took part last year in a Lotus 7 and are currently prepping one for the next event in 2015 (there was no event in 2014)
Next years runs from the South of Italy to the North.
An Elan Sprint is a regular participant.
Note the cracks to the wheel rim which came to light during the 2013 event on the Sprint
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PostPost by: Rozzer » Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:46 pm

Thank you all for sharing all this wonderful and useful feedback and advice; now I need to get my finger out and do something about it!!

I'll keep you posted :)
Ashton
1950 AJS 350M
1956 Lotus Eleven S1 (Tuft's car)
1964 Lotus Elan S2 26/4177
1998 Lotus Elise S1
2003 Mini Cooper S R53
2013 BMW 118d Conv
If you aren't living on the edge, you're taking up too much space
Rozzer
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