America Votes! Civil war predictions

[h20hamelan]

I do think he was put there to fool us.

As there is absolutely no way anyone would allow it, other than the “old boys club” for motives...Racial/immigration or otherwise.

And maybe the world is just too divided, with the real lack of minimum wage following inflation. Let’s face it, a Nurse made about $13 per hour in 1980. Now about $16 per. Or compare farmers, or...
I think the unrest will continue until people feel fairly treated.

[SENC]

Maybe true in Canada, but not in the US, RN starting comp (straight out of community college or university) is in the mid-$20s to low-$30s and the average hourly rate for nurses across the country is between $30/hr and $40/hr, depending on location (urban, suburban, rural, etc.). Whether that is enough or not given their expertise, training, and the difficulty of their work may be worthy of debate, but there is little doubt that RNs are in high demand in the US and their hourly rates have been trending positively and ahead of inflation as a result for the better part of the last 15 years.

[h20hamelan]

Sure, fair enough. I know not.
I do know, if inflation followed minimum wage. $35 per would be minimum in the USA, or about $42 in Canada.
So if these highly sought after positions, post college or university are barely minimum wage (or less than in Canada). It’s all a farce.
If a cap was put on income, similar to Hamilton now saying he may not race next year (as they have put a cap on drivers salaries). That would be fine with most people I suspect.

I think, we should go back to corner stores. Break up the big business similar to pre 1980’s business rules. And forget this world trade thing, GDP can come from regionalism. Just like renewable energy can propel humans.

Also I believe big business has stifled innovation, for the most part.

[The Veg]

I've met a few nurses who complain of crap wages and being forced to work unpaid-overtime, mostly in the employ of big corporate hospitals.

[h20hamelan]

Nursing, is not a minimum wage job (even ars wipping). I was just using it as an average pink collar job.
Flipping burgers, or delivering the paper if that still happens might be. These would be $35 per hour jobs, based on inflation or some people’s over-wealth.
On the other hand, nursing. Depending on degree’s etc, would be more like $60-$80
The point is, free trade (shipping containers) and CEO’s taking more than their value has created divide. This is where the unrest lies, I believe.

[elanner]

Of all the millions of words written about the last four years perhaps the best were in a poem that Bruce Springsteen posted on his website a few days ago:

There’s no art in this White House.
There’s no literature, no poetry, no music.
There are no pets in this White House, no loyal man’s best friend, no Socks the family cat, no kids’ science fairs.
No time when the president takes off his blue suit red tie uniform and becomes human, except when he puts on his white shirt and khaki pants uniform and hides from the American people to play golf.

There are no images of the First Family enjoying themselves together in a moment of relaxation.
No Obamas on the beach in Hawaii moments, or Bushes fishing in Kennebunkport.
No Reagans on horseback, no Kennedys playing touch football on the Cape.

Where’d that country go?

Where did all the fun, the joy and the expression of love and happiness go?
We used to be the country that did the Ice Bucket Challenge and raised millions for charity.
We used to have a President that calmed and soothed the nation instead dividing it, and a First Lady who planted a garden instead of ripping one out.

We are rudderless and joyless.
We have lost the cultural aspects of society that make America great.
We have lost our mojo, our fun, our happiness, our cheering on of others.
The shared experience of humanity that makes it all worth it.
The challenges and the triumphs that we shared and celebrated.
The unique can-do spirit that America has always been known for.

We are lost.

We have lost so much in so short a time.

-Elayne Griffin Baker

On November 3rd, vote them out.

[pharriso]

Of all the millions of words written about the last four years perhaps the best were in a poem that Bruce Springsteen posted on his website a few days ago:

There’s no art in this White House.
There’s no literature, no poetry, no music.
There are no pets in this White House, no loyal man’s best friend, no Socks the family cat, no kids’ science fairs.
No time when the president takes off his blue suit red tie uniform and becomes human, except when he puts on his white shirt and khaki pants uniform and hides from the American people to play golf.

There are no images of the First Family enjoying themselves together in a moment of relaxation.
No Obamas on the beach in Hawaii moments, or Bushes fishing in Kennebunkport.
No Reagans on horseback, no Kennedys playing touch football on the Cape.

Where’d that country go?

Where did all the fun, the joy and the expression of love and happiness go?
We used to be the country that did the Ice Bucket Challenge and raised millions for charity.
We used to have a President that calmed and soothed the nation instead dividing it, and a First Lady who planted a garden instead of ripping one out.

We are rudderless and joyless.
We have lost the cultural aspects of society that make America great.
We have lost our mojo, our fun, our happiness, our cheering on of others.
The shared experience of humanity that makes it all worth it.
The challenges and the triumphs that we shared and celebrated.
The unique can-do spirit that America has always been known for.

We are lost.

We have lost so much in so short a time.

-Elayne Griffin Baker

On November 3rd, vote them out.

Great post Nick, thank you! Nice summation of that man's empty soul....

[SENC]

I've met a few nurses who complain of crap wages and being forced to work unpaid-overtime, mostly in the employ of big corporate hospitals.

Not that we need to turn this into a thread about nurses, but if interested in the stats: https://www.nursingprocess.org/rn-salary/georgia/

Again, not saying it is enough, I can see that Atlanta might be a tough place to live on $70k, but it is what the market would bear in 2018.

I am curious how these wages compare to wages in the UK, though, and whether a state-run system has yielded better wages and benefits.

As for unpaid OT, GA law may be different, but in NC wage and hour law on the topic is quite clear and enforceable, so most larger employers, like hospitals, put in a lot of effort to be compliant.

[Slowtus]

I've met a few nurses who complain of crap wages and being forced to work unpaid-overtime, mostly in the employ of big corporate hospitals.

Let's encourage nurses to run for President, if/when one gets in - that should help with the "crap wages".

[billwill]

I've met a few nurses who complain of crap wages and being forced to work unpaid-overtime, mostly in the employ of big corporate hospitals.

Let's encourage nurses to run for President, if/when one gets in - that should help with the "crap wages".

A much simpler solution might be to bring in a rule that that all politicians on becoming an MP must give up all private heath insurance and must rely only on the NHS for their health.

[jimj]

·
Someone on Quora asked "Why do some British people not like Donald Trump?" Nate White, an articulate and witty writer from England wrote the following response:
A few things spring to mind.
Trump lacks certain qualities which the British traditionally esteem.
For instance, he has no class, no charm, no coolness, no credibility, no compassion, no wit, no warmth, no wisdom, no subtlety, no sensitivity, no self-awareness, no humility, no honour and no grace – all qualities, funnily enough, with which his predecessor Mr. Obama was generously blessed.
So for us, the stark contrast does rather throw Trump's limitations into embarrassingly sharp relief.
Plus, we like a laugh. And while Trump may be laughable, he has never once said anything wry, witty or even faintly amusing – not once, ever.
I don't say that rhetorically, I mean it quite literally: not once, not ever. And that fact is particularly disturbing to the British sensibility – for us, to lack humour is almost inhuman.
But with Trump, it's a fact. He doesn't even seem to understand what a joke is – his idea of a joke is a crass comment, an illiterate insult, a casual act of cruelty.
Trump is a troll. And like all trolls, he is never funny and he never laughs; he only crows or jeers.
And scarily, he doesn't just talk in crude, witless insults – he actually thinks in them. His mind is a simple bot-like algorithm of petty prejudices and knee-jerk nastiness.
There is never any under-layer of irony, complexity, nuance or depth. It's all surface.
Some Americans might see this as refreshingly upfront.
Well, we don't. We see it as having no inner world, no soul.
And in Britain we traditionally side with David, not Goliath. All our heroes are plucky underdogs: Robin Hood, Dick Whittington, Oliver Twist.
Trump is neither plucky, nor an underdog. He is the exact opposite of that.
He's not even a spoiled rich-boy, or a greedy fat-cat.
He's more a fat white slug. A Jabba the Hutt of privilege.
And worse, he is that most unforgivable of all things to the British: a bully.
That is, except when he is among bullies; then he suddenly transforms into a snivelling sidekick instead.
There are unspoken rules to this stuff – the Queensberry rules of basic decency – and he breaks them all. He punches downwards – which a gentleman should, would, could never do – and every blow he aims is below the belt. He particularly likes to kick the vulnerable or voiceless – and he kicks them when they are down.
So the fact that a significant minority – perhaps a third – of Americans look at what he does, listen to what he says, and then think 'Yeah, he seems like my kind of guy' is a matter of some confusion and no little distress to British people, given that:
• Americans are supposed to be nicer than us, and mostly are.
• You don't need a particularly keen eye for detail to spot a few flaws in the man.
This last point is what especially confuses and dismays British people, and many other people too; his faults seem pretty bloody hard to miss.
After all, it's impossible to read a single tweet, or hear him speak a sentence or two, without staring deep into the abyss. He turns being artless into an art form; he is a Picasso of pettiness; a Shakespeare of shit. His faults are fractal: even his flaws have flaws, and so on ad infinitum.
God knows there have always been stupid people in the world, and plenty of nasty people too. But rarely has stupidity been so nasty, or nastiness so stupid.
He makes Nixon look trustworthy and George W look smart.
In fact, if Frankenstein decided to make a monster assembled entirely from human flaws – he would make a Trump.
And a remorseful Doctor Frankenstein would clutch out big clumpfuls of hair and scream in anguish:
'My God... what... have... I... created?
If being a twat was a TV show, Trump would be the boxed set.
Source: jobsanger: British Writer Pens The Best Description Of Trump I've Read

[2cams70]

You need to be able to separate the character of a person from the concrete things they have achieved. For example some might have described Colin Chapman as being a somewhat shady and ruthless character but does this necessarily detract from what he achieved?

In the case of Trump from the alternative media (Sky News here in Australia) they have the following positive things to say about Trump. I make no judgement either way. We are all captive to the information we receive from the popular media and it's no secret that the popular media absolutely hate Trump and he is the underdog in that regard. Did you hear about Biden's son and the lost laptops currently under FBI investigation in the popular media? - no way!!

1/ Does not pander to the Chinese (or anyone for that matter)
2/ One of the few American presidents not send his people to unwinnable wars. Indeed he made a point of pulling ground troops out of wars
3/ Achieved peace in the middle east by acknowledging Jerusalem as the capital of Israel.
4/ Kept jobs in America rather than shifting them offshore.

They also say he achieved a big increase in votes from minorities in the recent election - Hispanics, black Americans and gays. He decreased the unemployment rate amongst these minorities.

I'm not saying he was perfect but he certainly wasn't all bad. Let's face it to be the top of the pile be it of a country or a company you need to be a bit of an asshole. That's the cold hard reality.

I for one like Mike Pence. Much more level headed and rational than Donald Trump

[pharriso]

You need to be able to separate the character of a person from the concrete things they have achieved. For example some might have described Colin Chapman as being a somewhat shady and ruthless character but does this necessarily detract from what he achieved?

In the case of Trump from the alternative media (Sky News here in Australia) they have the following positive things to say about Trump. I make no judgement either way. We are all captive to the information we receive from the popular media and it's no secret that the popular media absolutely hate Trump and he is the underdog in that regard. Did you hear about Biden's son and the lost laptops currently under FBI investigation in the popular media? - no way!!

1/ Does not pander to the Chinese (or anyone for that matter)
2/ One of the few American presidents not send his people to unwinnable wars. Indeed he made a point of pulling ground troops out of wars
3/ Achieved peace in the middle east by acknowledging Jerusalem as the capital of Israel.
4/ Kept jobs in America rather than shifting them offshore.

They also say he achieved a big increase in votes from minorities in the recent election - Hispanics, black Americans and gays. He decreased the unemployment rate amongst these minorities.

I'm not saying he was perfect but he certainly wasn't all bad. Let's face it to be the top of the pile be it of a country or a company you need to be a bit of an asshole. That's the cold hard reality.

1, Hmmm, what has he actually done?... trade war with China has bankrupted mid-west Farmers. No change in intellectual property rights...Done nothing supporting democratic reforms & Hong-Kong

2. He's abandonded America's friends in Syria etc...What I do appreciate is him encouraging countries to pay more of there own defense.

3. Bullshit, he's allowed the Israeli's to walk over the Palestinians. Until they agree to co-exist there will be war forever.

4. Bullshit, Carrier jobs still went to Mexico etc etc Theres no more jobs in MI, OH & WV thanks to Trump. You create jobs by investing in education & research, as in Germany.

The amazing thing about Trump is how he managed to convince his followers what he will / has done. The amazing / best medical system that he promised 4 years ago is still MIA. The Jobs for coal miners?... yet they still support him...

Re Unemplyment rates, working 2 minimum wage jobs is not the same as one good quality blue collar job.

I for one like Mike Pence. Much more level headed and rational than Donald Trump

That does not take a lot, but he is a religous bigot that is anti gay, anti-choice etc etc. Calls his wife "Mother..."

[2cams70]

The amazing / best medical system that he promised 4 years ago is still MIA

Yep agree with you there. It's important that society has a safety net for those unable to pay. One thing I really hate about the left though is their attempts to silence free speech and their hypocrisy.

[mbell]

I think you bring a fair point, but in the case of Trump the negatives seem to or outway anything he achieved by a long way. But that is my personal opinion and everyone has there own on that.

Did you hear about Biden's son and the lost laptops currently under FBI investigation in the popular media? - no way!!

I have heard about it a lot. I've seen nothing but noise and no evidence. Given they have been trying to smear biden for years is not really something I can take seriously as anything more than a poor smear campaign.

One thing I really hate about the left though is their attempts to silence free speech and their hypocrisy.

Again my opinion and as such is a lot of crap, I kind of agree that boycott this and that is getting a bit extreme.

What you have to understand is that there is no limits to free speech on the USA, so people are free to say whatever they want with little to no comeback on them. Historically people would exercise some self control to not look like some bigot or something. But if you just look at some of the qanon conspiracy theories going around and the fact US senators are voicing these theories shows that's no longer the case.

So what have people left to do when a person or company gets way out of line with their beliefs? Hit them where it hurts in their wallets by arranging mass boycotts.

On the opposite side of this is if you look at democrats that ran against Lindsay Graham and his fund raising. That fund raising was really people all over the country protesting against Graham and his behavior around the supreme court nominee and Trump. People were using their wallets to donate as a protest and as a expression of free speech against him.

The fact is free speech only really works if people respect it and are responsible with it. When people are prepared to completely abuse it for their own personal or political gains with no comeback m them you have big big problems as the USA is finding out.