Lotus Elan

Elan Parking Brakes, can they be made to work?

PostPost by: nebogipfel » Wed Jul 18, 2012 9:04 pm

stugilmour wrote: I think I get it now. The rod you are talking about is the one the knurled adjuster screws to (36 J 6039 - Rod, tie). Makes sense.


Correct :wink:
John

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PostPost by: robertverhey » Wed Jul 18, 2012 10:06 pm

C'mon Alex, don't be shy, show us your nipple!
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PostPost by: Elanman99 » Wed Jul 18, 2012 10:19 pm

gearbox wrote:I have a S4 with less than functional parking brakes. You pull the umbrella handle and you get a slight grip, but a 10 degree grade easily over comes that. I have spoken to several knowledgable Dyed in the wool Lotus owners who all tell me it is a useless endeavour and have all deleted the component from their cars. Leaving the car in gear while parked is not a good solution for me (personal choice) I would like to repair or mod the brake system to work correctly. Any ideas? Thanks Allan


In my first few years of Elan ownership I went through handbrake pads on a regular basis, I was forever adjusting to take up pad wear and even new pads needed regular adjustment. I fitted springs to hold the caliper arms apart but even then the pads still wore away very qiuickly.

I rebuilt the car in the 80s and overhauled the calipers myself. I completely stripped the handbrake mechanism and carefully studied how it was meant to operate, it was only then I learned the significance of the 'Centralising strips'. I had dutifully removed and refitted them every time I replaced the pads but mistakenly had thought their purpose was something to do with keeping the pads in place so had never 'reshaped' them.
If the caliper and linkages are not too worn and the various pivots free to move the Elan handbrake is more than up to the job, my non scientific test is to see whether it will lock the rear wheels (on gravel!) at 25mph.
Nowadays I actually use the handbrake as I would on any other car and only adjust the handbrake once a year prior to the MOT. I have not fitted new pads because of wear in the last 10 years, but I did need some because two fell apart when rust penetrated the friction material bond.

I dont know what dye or what wool the so called knowledgeable Lotus owners use but their assumptions are way off beam. Deleting the brake seems an odd way to cure the problem!

Ian
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PostPost by: elansprint71 » Wed Jul 18, 2012 10:26 pm

Elanman99 wrote:
gearbox wrote:I have a S4 with less than functional parking brakes. You pull the umbrella handle and you get a slight grip, but a 10 degree grade easily over comes that. I have spoken to several knowledgable Dyed in the wool Lotus owners who all tell me it is a useless endeavour and have all deleted the component from their cars. Leaving the car in gear while parked is not a good solution for me (personal choice) I would like to repair or mod the brake system to work correctly. Any ideas? Thanks Allan


In my first few years of Elan ownership I went through handbrake pads on a regular basis, I was forever adjusting to take up pad wear and even new pads needed regular adjustment. I fitted springs to hold the caliper arms apart but even then the pads still wore away very qiuickly.

I rebuilt the car in the 80s and overhauled the calipers myself. I completely stripped the handbrake mechanism and carefully studied how it was meant to operate, it was only then I learned the significance of the 'Centralising strips'. I had dutifully removed and refitted them every time I replaced the pads but mistakenly had thought their purpose was something to do with keeping the pads in place so had never 'reshaped' them.
If the caliper and linkages are not too worn and the various pivots free to move the Elan handbrake is more than up to the job, my non scientific test is to see whether it will lock the rear wheels (on gravel!) at 25mph.
Nowadays I actually use the handbrake as I would on any other car and only adjust the handbrake once a year prior to the MOT. I have not fitted new pads because of wear in the last 10 years, but I did need some because two fell apart when rust penetrated the friction material bond.

I dont know what dye or what wool the so called knowledgeable Lotus owners use but their assumptions are way off beam. Deleting the brake seems an odd way to cure the problem!

Ian


Yeah? Try telling that to kids/Elan owners today.

Remind us (them) how many years of Elan ownership you have under your belt.

:twisted:
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PostPost by: lotusS2guy » Wed Jul 18, 2012 11:03 pm

While everyone is thinking about parking brakes, can someone post a picture or set of pictures showing the routing of the parking brake cable on a LHD Elan. I removed mine many years ago and when I went to reinstall it, I completely blanked out on the proper routing. I should have photographed it. My bad. :cry:

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PostPost by: Henry VIIII » Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:04 am

nebogipfel wrote:
rgh0 wrote:If these are not adjust properly (by bending them!!) then one or both pads drag on the disk and rapidly wear meaning the hand brake always needs adjustment to work for just a short while and people finally give up and say they dont work.
Rohan


The best solution to this is to fit compression springs over the rods so that the pads spring away from the disks when you release the lever.



You best do BOTH, springs to push the pads apart and the holdoff 'levers' to make sure the pads are held off symmetrically, not one still rubbing.

The hold off arms are not very springy deliberately, so that the do permanently bend inwards as the pads wear. You must bend them out each time you fit new pads or if you can see that they have permanently bent inwards too far.
Henry
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PostPost by: alexblack13 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:01 am

robertverhey wrote:C'mon Alex, don't be shy, show us your nipple!



Here you go.. A wee selection of handbrake pics.. Note they are not getting fettled every 10 mins.. You can tell. The car has now done 7k mls since its resto and that handbrake has not been touched.

Everybody has there ways of doing things so to each their own I say. No right and no wrong.. Take your pick.
Attachments
IMG_4516.JPG and
Note where the spring is. Hopefully remove any ambiguity
IMG_4524.JPG and
Handbrake pulled slightly ON. Note levers slightly off their stops
IMG_4522.JPG and
Slacken the grubs and move it along the cable after returning adjustments to zero if you need to.
IMG_4521.JPG and
Stainless nipple held with two 4mm grubs with two more on top to 'lock'.
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PostPost by: Maulden7 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:49 am

To keep the pads off the disc, & make the handbrake very effective, for many years now I have been using a pair of heavy rated suspension coil springs as used on a large remote control type model car.

These are perfect for length (compressed when fitted hence pushing the pads outwards) fit over the rod easily, but have no effect whatsoever on the rest of the mechanism. I keep the system adjusted & effective, permanently.

Dead easy to fit, effective, & very cheap.

+1 on the box spanner & other comments if needed for adjustment.
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PostPost by: garyeanderson » Thu Jul 19, 2012 9:58 am

lotusS2guy wrote:While everyone is thinking about parking brakes, can someone post a picture or set of pictures showing the routing of the parking brake cable on a LHD Elan. I removed mine many years ago and when I went to reinstall it, I completely blanked out on the proper routing. I should have photographed it. My bad. :cry:

Herb
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Hi Herb

I think that its covered in the topic linked below, it might be a good for others to look at too.

elan-f14/sows-ear-chassis-t24752-30.html

Gary
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PostPost by: Jentwistle3 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:06 pm

On my S2 if I tug on the umbrella handle hard enough to get the parking brake to hold the car the handle jams, and I can't release it. I have to loosen the cable via the adjuster to release the handle. Any thoughts?
-John
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PostPost by: alexblack13 » Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:13 pm

I think you need to take off the lever assembly and determine where it's jamming. it should be see-able when its on the bench.

Good luck and keep us posted when you find it.

Alex.
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PostPost by: [email protected] » Thu Jul 19, 2012 4:12 pm

There is a little part, usually missing, that makes adjusting the handbrake at the caliper very easy. Without the part it becomes almost impossible to adjust such that the brake is effective without having the pads drag all the time. This part is a little bushing that is in the hole at the end of the operating lever and takes up the space of the little bolt that ties the link to the lever. The bolt is smaller in O.D. than the operating lever hole but correct for the clevis at the end of the link. The original part number is X026J0015Z and the new one I just measured is .1970" ID, .2985" OD and .25" long.
When I started trying to sort my S2 handbrake system out (the S3 worked just great) I battled adjustment until I discovered these things missing. For some reason I had the perfect tubing at hand, cut off for two and inserted them in the lever hole and reassembled. Magic ! Handbrakes work very well and can be adjusted without handbrake pad drag. Added springs to prevent rattle and it's been that way for 20+ years now.
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PostPost by: stugilmour » Thu Jul 19, 2012 4:16 pm

Jentwistle3 wrote:On my S2 if I tug on the umbrella handle hard enough to get the parking brake to hold the car the handle jams, and I can't release it. I have to loosen the cable via the adjuster to release the handle. Any thoughts?
-John


John, mine does that right now as well. I am presently assuming this issue is caused by the extra length in the cable forcing me to pull the handle too far for easy release, or the issue of the tree lever hitting the diff and jamming at the rear. Just a guess mind you, but figure I have to follow up on the other service and adjustment tips first to make sense of the jamming annoyance.

I think I have found a local shop that can re-line the handbrake shoes. Also thinking about the Susan Miller adjustable actuating rods for the 'full meal deal'.

Thanks again guys. Very comprehensive thread. Did we scare off the OP? :) With all the tips here I guess the short answer is it can be made to work well with a bit of effort and knowledge. :)

Cheers!
Stu
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PostPost by: Foxie » Thu Jul 19, 2012 5:33 pm

[email protected] wrote:There is a little part, usually missing, that makes adjusting the handbrake at the caliper very easy. Without the part it becomes almost impossible to adjust such that the brake is effective without having the pads drag all the time. This part is a little bushing that is in the hole at the end of the operating lever and takes up the space of the little bolt that ties the link to the lever. The bolt is smaller in O.D. than the operating lever hole but correct for the clevis at the end of the link. The original part number is X026J0015Z and the new one I just measured is .1970" ID, .2985" OD <>
and .25" long.


Any chance of a pic or drawing ? :)
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PostPost by: garyeanderson » Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:32 pm

Sean Murray wrote:
[email protected] wrote:There is a little part, usually missing, that makes adjusting the handbrake at the caliper very easy. Without the part it becomes almost impossible to adjust such that the brake is effective without having the pads drag all the time. This part is a little bushing that is in the hole at the end of the operating lever and takes up the space of the little bolt that ties the link to the lever. The bolt is smaller in O.D. than the operating lever hole but correct for the clevis at the end of the link. The original part number is X026J0015Z and the new one I just measured is .1970" ID, .2985" OD <>
and .25" long.


Any chance of a pic or drawing ? :)


No drawings, only pictures that tell a story.

handbrake pull bush.JPG and


handbrake pull bush loose.JPG and


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