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PostPost by: paddy » Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:53 am

gordont wrote:thanks all, so on the question of oil just a standard gearbox oil??


Setting aside all of the debate over grease vs oil vs half and half ...

EP90, if you're in the oil camp, is what's recommended.

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PostPost by: ardee_selby » Wed Mar 02, 2011 11:09 am

I'm in the oil camp & have always used EP 90...but not sure what spec the last stuff I bought was...

The Triumph guys emphasise GL4, but as opposed to what?....found related info in Ref. 2

Ref. 1 -
http://www.tssc.org.uk/index.php?option ... 9&id=43494

Ref. 2 -
http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm? ... 197&page=3

Cheers - Richard
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:13 pm

GL4 oils have less sulphur and are nominally less corrosive to the brass trunion. At the actual operating temperature of the trunion this is not a real issue and a GL5 with its better EP lubrication probably actually better common knowledge on the net is not a guarrantee of accuracy. A EP water proof grease is better still but that a whole other argument :D
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PostPost by: alexblack13 » Wed Mar 02, 2011 2:31 pm

Hi Gordon..

Just a good gearbox 80/90 oil will be great. Everyone has their own pref' so you will no doubt hear from them. I like liquid grease for EG...

To each their own though. Oil is the universally agreed lub for the trunnions..

Have fun.. :wink:

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PostPost by: john w » Sat Mar 05, 2011 11:44 am

Gordon
You must remove all of that old congealed grease from your steering swivels if they have been previously greased - they were not designed for grease. Otherwise you are storing up troubles. You need to get a grease gun suitable for oil. Frosts (www.frost.co.uk) do a push type gun (catalogue ref N365) which I think (and I only think) will fit ok providing you screw in an angled grease nipple. I guess Sealey and others will also do an oil compatible grease gun.

You need to get an old fashioned EP90 gear oil free of various additives as some modern additives can react with the brass of the swivel. Millers Oils (millersoils.co.uk) will do a suitable oil but I can't recall their ref no - talk to their helpline. You can't purchase direct from Millers. I often purchase their oils from Jeff Smith Classic Lubricants (01430 828453) but Frosts above also do a range of Miller oils. You might also find a local distributor.

The original lower swivel lubrication service interval was every 6000 miles (B and C services) but I have always been accustomed to lubricating earlier. Oil needs to be pumped in until clear new oil extrudes round the rubber seals. The original Lotus advice was to screw in a suitable grease nipple and replace it with the screw-in plug after lubrication.

Hope this is helpful and I am not telling my grandmother how to suck eggs.
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PostPost by: rgh0 » Sat Mar 05, 2011 12:53 pm

elanboy wrote:Gordon
You must remove all of that old congealed grease from your steering swivels if they have been previously greased - they were not designed for grease. .......

You need to get an old fashioned EP90 gear oil free of various additives as some modern additives can react with the brass of the swivel. .............

Hope this is helpful and I am not telling my grandmother how to suck eggs.



Sorry but classic repeats of on going myths

grease is a far better lubricant than oils in this service - talk to any lubrication engineer about water proof EP grease in a low speed application like this versus an oil. Its a myth that you have to use oil, despite any original specification from Lotus or Triumph grease works just fine as has been proved over the last 40 years.

If using an oil use an EP gear oil with additives that provide the extreme pressure lubrication, the old EP oils such as Millers used a high sulphur formula ( just smell it) as does most new ones (Redline have lower levels than most) . These sulphur based additives can corrode brass at high tempratures but at the low temp of the trunnion cause no problems, its a myth

The reality is provide you change it frequently enough almost anything works in this relatively low stress situation which is why the debate :D

I worry much more about failure of the upright from fatigue cracks that wear from poor lubrication

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PostPost by: gerrym » Sat Mar 05, 2011 1:06 pm

Rohan, re your comment on the fatigue cracks: I've changed over to solid uprights now (grease nipple in the base of the trunnion).

However, do you have a copy of Peterson's, the book with all the classic stress concentration factors. If yes, and you could scan one off page, I'll see if I can quantify the effect of the grease/oil drilling through the centre.

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PostPost by: rgh0 » Sat Mar 05, 2011 1:19 pm

Hi Gerry

I dont have the book you refer to.. The cracks will propogate from the outside at the root of the thread. The hole in the middle will have a limited effect of reducing this tendency once the crack starts. A new solid trunnion will be good more because it is new than because it is solid. Its the 40 year old ones with an unknown history of hitting kerbs you have to be careful of.

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PostPost by: john w » Sat Mar 05, 2011 5:42 pm

Rohan
I would not want to disagree with anything you say. I have always used oil (in accordance with the original Lotus recomendations) more from habit rather than any good technical reason. The swivels on my one owner Elan have done round about 170,000 miles with oil lube. I recently took them apart - as far as I could tell, there was minimum wear and no signs of any corrosion so I put them back. I put this down to being meticulous to keeping them well lubricated and cleanliness during the lubrication process (as has been noted) rather than whether or not I was using oil or grease. My experience is that for oil lubrication, the originally recomended 6000 mile service interval is too long particularly if the car is being used in bad weather.

Dare I tell you that after many years, I am now thinking of changing over to a waterproof grease principally for durability reasons of grease in the environmentof the swivels. So Rohan, what grease do you recomend?

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PostPost by: gordont » Fri Mar 18, 2011 7:14 am

Thanks for all the advice.
1/4" UNF nipples purchased (much to my wifes amusement) and installed, GL4 squeezed in by a trusty very old oil gun I found under the house, cleaned out and hey presto.

cheers guys
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