Lotus Elan

Knock-On Alloy Wheel Drive Pegs

PostPost by: summerinmaine » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:41 am

bcmc33 wrote:
summerinmaine wrote:Just went out to measure my drive pegs, even though I'm currently running steel wheels, because my car came with a set of Panasports and I might decide to fit them with some new rubber when I finish the resurrection. My pegs are 11mm, of which 4mm are the chamfers. Should I think about custom making some longer pegs or are these already longer than OEM?

Your pegs have a 7mm drive length in the wheel - more that double the 3mm I have. I would have thought that will be OK.

To make even longer pegs may be ideal but what is the depth of the holes in the Panasports? As I said, the holes in the Minilites are 16.5mm deep, so I shall make new pegs at 15mm with a 4mm chamfer to give 11mm drive.


I just measured my Panasports and they are approx. 17.5mm deep in total, and about 3mm of that is taper from the drill.

So I'm probably fine with the pegs that I have. My FWSM shows both the early and late pegs, but gives no dimension for the driving section. If the drawings are to scale however, it appears that the driving and chamfer sections are about equal, so it would appear that your pegs are stock, and mine were replaced to accommodate the Panasports.

BTW the OWSM omits any reference to knock-ons or drive pegs, and only depicts the bolt on wheels. I've always thought it was an S1 manual, and this seems to reinforce that belief.
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PostPost by: summerinmaine » Sun Sep 05, 2010 1:14 am

OBTW I have consistently referred to my wheels as Panasports, as that's what I was told when they were given to me, but in looking them over I don't see the name anywhere, and the only glyph that looks like a maker's mark is this one:



100_0630_1.jpg and


Is this correct for a Panasport? If not, any ideas as to what it might be?

Thanks.

Edit: Never mind my query. I just found an image on RD Enterprises and that mark appears correct.
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PostPost by: Old English White » Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:14 am

summerinmaine wrote:OBTW I have consistently referred to my wheels as Panasports, as that's what I was told when they were given to me, but in looking them over I don't see the name anywhere, and the only glyph that looks like a maker's mark is this one:



100_0630_1.jpg


Is this correct for a Panasport? If not, any ideas as to what it might be?

Thanks.

Edit: Never mind my query. I just found an image on RD Enterprises and that mark appears correct.


No Panasport marking ... Even my Peugeot 307SW has them on its alloys.
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PostPost by: oldelanman » Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:38 am

summerinmaine wrote:Just went out to measure my drive pegs, even though I'm currently running steel wheels, because my car came with a set of Panasports and I might decide to fit them with some new rubber when I finish the resurrection. My pegs are 11mm, of which 4mm are the chamfers. Should I think about custom making some longer pegs or are these already longer than OEM?


Well curiosity finally got the better of me and I've measured my drive pegs - 11mm overall with 4mm chamfers the same as yours Jim. My car has never had alloy wheels fitted and as far as I know the pegs are original (stock). With the later parallel peg the amount that protrudes depends on how far the peg is driven into the hub, not just on the overall length. Maybe yours were replaced at some stage Brian and not driven fully home - are all four hubs the same on your car? The Workshop Manual says nothing about how far they should be driven in - only that it is necessary to heat the hub to do it. Brian Buckland says they should be driven in until flush with the back face of the hub.

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PostPost by: GrUmPyBoDgEr » Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:55 am

Old English White wrote:
summerinmaine wrote:OBTW I have consistently referred to my wheels as Panasports, as that's what I was told when they were given to me, but in looking them over I don't see the name anywhere, and the only glyph that looks like a maker's mark is this one:



100_0630_1.jpg


Is this correct for a Panasport? If not, any ideas as to what it might be?

Thanks.

Edit: Never mind my query. I just found an image on RD Enterprises and that mark appears correct.


No Panasport marking ... Even my Peugeot 307SW has them on its alloys.
Image
Christian. :mrgreen:


Thanks for that Christian, I often wondered what that JWL marking was.
All of the Alloy Wheels that I've seen here in Germany carry that marking. (even on Peugeot's)
BMW used to carry out destructive testing on all supplied Alloy Wheels but I suppose a standard of conformity is sufficient to eliminate that testing.

Oh, & all of the British supplied Alloys that I've bought did not have any markings!
Food for thought?
:roll:

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PostPost by: summerinmaine » Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:16 pm

Thanks for the clarification on the mark.

Maybe I should take a look at my Tii's alloy wheels for casting marks. They were only fitted as original to the Tii, the 2800 CS and the 3.0 CS and CSI so far as I know.
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PostPost by: GrUmPyBoDgEr » Sun Sep 05, 2010 1:22 pm

summerinmaine wrote:Thanks for the clarification on the mark.

Maybe I should take a look at my Tii's alloy wheels for casting marks. They were only fitted as original to the Tii, the 2800 CS and the 3.0 CS and CSI so far as I know.


If I remember correctly those Cars were fitted with BBS wheels & I think they were the only supplier of Alloys to BMW at the time.
They probably will have that Mark on them; but if not don't worry, you can rest assured that BMW's Laboratories & Durability Testing Departments put those Wheels "through the Mill" before releasing them for Production.
No accounting for their age & what (mis)treatment your Wheels have had however.

Ooops, we seem to have drifted off Subject again. :oops:
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PostPost by: bcmc33 » Sun Sep 05, 2010 5:15 pm

Full set of longer drive pegs now made. I will make efforts to fit them tomorrow.
One wheel set shown below:
Drive Pegs.JPG and

I've made them 28mm long. (13mm in hub + 11mm drive in wheel + 4mm chamfer.)

The stock items that were removed were 20mm long. (13mm in hub + 3mm for steel wheel + 4mm chamfer.)
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PostPost by: davea » Mon Sep 06, 2010 5:35 pm

I just removed drive pegs from a (presumed original) knock-off wheel hub and
the pegs are just over 18mm long (weight 12.5 grams). Newly US-sourced drive pegs are
just over 20mm long (weight 14 grams). Not that it matters, but
now I wonder what 'original length' really is/was.
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PostPost by: billwill » Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:31 pm

bcmc33 wrote:Full set of longer drive pegs now made. I will make efforts to fit them tomorrow.
One wheel set shown below:
Drive Pegs.JPG

I've made them 28mm long. (13mm in hub + 11mm drive in wheel + 4mm chamfer.)

The stock items that were removed were 20mm long. (13mm in hub + 3mm for steel wheel + 4mm chamfer.)



I thought my pegs have larger dia flat bits at the back to stop them wiggling through to the outside.
But I could be very wrong on this and I'm not going to go down & take a wheel off at this time of night to verify it.
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PostPost by: bcmc33 » Mon Sep 06, 2010 11:07 pm

billwill wrote:I thought my pegs have larger dia flat bits at the back to stop them wiggling through to the outside.

Bill,

The original pegs were a 'top hat' design with a flange which meant they had to be fitted from the rear side of the hub. Brian Buckland's manual page 406 shows one and says they were fitted up to mid S3 build date.
The plain diameter type are conveniently fitted from the front side of the hub.
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PostPost by: elj221c » Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:39 pm

bcmc33 wrote:I've made them 28mm long. (13mm in hub + 11mm drive in wheel + 4mm chamfer.)

The stock items that were removed were 20mm long. (13mm in hub + 3mm for steel wheel + 4mm chamfer.)


When I first bought my S2 in '75, the NS rear tyre was bald. The reason for this was that the PO had lost all the drive pegs for that side and the wheel had just tightened up under drive conditions, so much so, that I had to take the car to a tyre shop to have the wheel removed. None of my attempts (or the POs!) to get the wheel off were successful.
Whilst the car was there I bought some replacements, plain ones as shown in the previous photo, as the original style was no longer available. These were put in but when I got the car home and took the wheel off to investigate they promptly fell out.
Fortunately my neighbour, a model engineer with a lathe, made me up some new ones which were a press fit in the hub and were of the same pattern as the originals, with the 'hat brim' at the back of the hub. Despite the push fit they were locktighted in. They are still there now.
We made the new ones a tad longer. The originals as you can see in the photo are shorter at 8mm protrusion whereas the 'new' ones protrude by 11mm, as can been seen on the pin at the top of the picture. Both chamfered at about 3mm. Not one of the other hubs had its full compliment of pins intact which is why this OS rear can be seen to have a mixture of original and 'new' ones.
The wheels in use are JAPearce alloys and there have been no problems since.

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PostPost by: bcmc33 » Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:17 am

From Roy's pictures it is easy to see why Lotus changed the design.

To eliminate the spot facing operation from the rear of the hub and make the pegs from BDMS at the correct diameter would have made a reasonable cost saving in the eyes of ACBC.
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PostPost by: billwill » Wed Sep 08, 2010 5:45 pm

And don't forget the lightness :D
those top hat pins must be heavier than the plain ones.

:lol:
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PostPost by: bcmc33 » Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:19 pm

billwill wrote:And don't forget the lightness :D
those top hat pins must be heavier than the plain ones.

:lol:

A flaw in your point, Bill. What about the material not removed with no spot faces? 8) 8)
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