Lotus Elan

caliper / hose leak

PostPost by: rdssdi » Sat Apr 18, 2009 7:47 pm

I replaced my flex brake lines on my Elan +2 with stainless braided hoses.

These lines go directly to the caliper and do away with the short section of brake hard line that goes into the caliper and joins the flex line at a bulkhead junction mounted on an "L" bracket .

This new system seemed ideal except I had some initial problems with leaks. The banjo fitting that goes into the caliper now seals on the banjo fitting using a copper crush washer at the top of caliper body as opposed to the original hard line which seals (flare) in the bottom of the threaded opening for the fitting. I finally found the proper crush washers and thought I had the brakes leak free. I serviced the car today and it appears a small leak has started from the right front caliper banjo fitting.

I would like to find a fitting that will screw into the caliper and seal at the bottom, as the flared hard line did, and offer a treaded fitting on the other end for either a new flex line with an "AN" female fitting or possibly something that would accept a banjo.

Any suggestions? I may have to replace, (both front and rear), the hard line to bracket/bulkhead fitting at each caliper.

BOB
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PostPost by: patrics » Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:22 am

Bob

A few points that you may have already covered.

Make sure that the banjo mounting face on the caliper is clean and scratch free.
If using copper washers then heat until cherry red and immediately quench in water to anneal.

There are parts available from Goodridge and others using the standard mounting face but their not cheap.

The best option is to get the banjo to work properly in the first place after all it?s a standard proven method that will work.
Second is to refit the hard line and connect to that.

Regards
Steve
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PostPost by: rdssdi » Sun Apr 19, 2009 12:28 pm

What is the thread on the Girling 16P calipers? What specific part is it that Goodridge makes that could be used?

Bob
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PostPost by: Jason1 » Sun Apr 19, 2009 2:16 pm

3/8 UNF rings a bell?

Are they the HEL hoses? I just ordered a set last night.
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PostPost by: rdssdi » Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:40 pm

I purchased them from Dave Bean in the U.s..

I will anneal the washers and reattach but I rather get a fitting that is rounded as is a flare and seats in the bottom of the threaded portion in the caliper.

Bob
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PostPost by: gerrym » Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:18 am

Bob, thread is definitely 3/8UNF. Sealing in the bottom of the hole (against the flare) is much superior to sealing with a banjo: firstly the seal diameter is much smaller, hence less make-up force required to achive the same sealing pressure. secondly there's one less sealing surface (banjo washer has two faces), lastly the surface condition is less critical because the flare has a lot more compliance against surface defects compared to a banjo washer.

Original system with the hard-line segment was a pain in the a...., mainly because the L bracket was so flimsy it made diassembly difficult. Replace the L backet with a thicker one made from stainless strip (3mm I think) and the original system will work just fine.

Regards

Gerry
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PostPost by: cabc26b » Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:44 pm

Hi Bob -

Pegasus has a whole section on brake adapter fittings and banjo's take a look there, I think based on your ask , is what I did on a set of AR's ( illustration below -)
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PostPost by: CBUEB1771 » Thu Apr 23, 2009 11:06 pm

I don't disagree with any of Gerry's comments however the banjo fittings work perfectly well with proper preparation. The Elan uses banjo fittings with crush washers on all four calipers as standard fitment. I have a high pressure flexible line between the master cylinder and servo on my +2 with a banjo at the servo end. This has never given any problem. I made this change because I was never happy with the idea of two hydraulic devices fitted on a flexible fiberglass panel and connected by a hard steel line. It looked like a work hardening fracture on the way. I have always used soft aluminum crush washers available from all of the usual suspects.
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