Lotus Elan

Brakes- Assistance Please!

PostPost by: nico » Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:21 pm

Thanks to eveyone for all the tips and experiences and i'll give it a go
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PostPost by: nico » Wed Apr 22, 2009 8:34 pm

Hi all,
Still having problems bleeding the brakes using a sealey Mity vac - it seems that althoug the bleed nipples when opened get really slack - and when sucking the air out - it seems to suck surrounding air and not the air from within the system and feels as though it is not working properly.

This may seem like a stupid question - but how do you seal the threads ti minimise sucking in air from outside the system - someone mentioned greasing the threads- what with Brake Caliper Grease or copaslip?

Alos after spending 40.00 GBP on amity vac I am getting the impression that a manual method of bleeding the system is best.

Any further tips appreciated :oops: :roll:

thanks in advance
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PostPost by: gerrym » Thu Apr 23, 2009 9:29 am

Nico, have you considered using SpeedBleeders http://www.speedbleeder.com/ in combination with most of the above advice.

Demon Tweaks sell them

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PostPost by: steveww » Thu Apr 23, 2009 10:04 am

I have just completed this job and know what a PITA it is. Not helped by the brake reservoir being hidden under the carbs.

I used a vacuum type bleeder which does tend to draw air passed the nipple threads, the trick is to open the nipple just enough to get the fluid flowing but not too much to let too much air in.

I went round the car starting a the calliper furtherest away from the master cylinder. Then I pumped the brake pedal hard a few times. This sequence was repeated a few times.

If everything is new the brakes will still be a bit sponge like until the pads and seals bed in.

I found after taking out the servo and fitting +2 front brakes to my Elan the system improved considerably.
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PostPost by: surveyor » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:30 am

Nico,

I'm with MCT340 - bleed the master cylinder first.

I had the same problem bleeding a complete new brake system in my Sprite last year. Bleeding per the book for hours with no result. Finally undid the main line out of the master cylinder and bled it with a thumb over the outlet hole. Thumb closing outlet - wife presses and holds brake pedal - thumb off to release air pressure in M/C - thumb on - wife releases pedal then presses and holds - thumb off - you get the picture.

A couple of strokes only needed to get fluid coming through and then it was back on with the pipe and bleed system in 10 minutes flat. Am guessing that the "springyness" of the volume of air in a completely empty system in some way prevents the master from self-priming, but whatever the reason, it works.

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PostPost by: twincamman » Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:47 am

ok Nico ---I also have just completed re bleeding the brakes ----first I suggest a set of easy bleed nipples with them its a one man easy job --1/4 turn of the nipple 5 or 6 pumps of the pedal tighten and its a cylinder done times 4 ---I f you cant get them wrap the bleed nipples you have in Teflon tape and re install them ---the tape prevents air leaking back into the bottom of the bleed nipple ----next give your wife the day off and either use a vacuum pump [ recommended ]or get some one with a size 10 foot to put some grunt on the pedal and willing to take instructions from a mere male ---------I assume you have pre bled the master before installation -----use clean fluid and once its been through the system throw it out ---change it every year or two -----ed
dont close your eyes --you will miss the crash
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PostPost by: gerrym » Fri Apr 24, 2009 7:50 am

Twincamman, "easybleed" nipples. Are these the same as the Speedbleeders? (see my post just above.

I know Speedbleeders are easy to obtain in the UK (eg via DemonTweaks). They are just a non-return valve so that when the taper is off the seat, hydraulic fluid and air can be expelled out of the caliper. Due to the Non-return valve, air does not re-enter during the up stroke of the pedal. The whole job becomes a one man exercise with minimum equipment. They also have a thick coating of pre-applied thread sealant to solve/reduce the problem of air ingress back pass the threads. After much use, this can be re-applied, or the teflon tape added as per your suggestion.

Regards

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PostPost by: twincamman » Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:59 am

yep --thats them --[the easy way to bleed your brakes --speed bleed --or bleed you bastard [in Austrailia ] :lol: ---ed
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PostPost by: collins_dan » Fri Apr 24, 2009 1:08 pm

What size speedbleeders does a Elan require? Dan S4SE Federal
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PostPost by: collins_dan » Fri Apr 24, 2009 1:45 pm

Looks like some comments in the archives about using SB3824, which come in 2 lengths and the longer ones work best. If someone could confirm, that would be great. Thanks, Dan
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PostPost by: twincamman » Fri Apr 24, 2009 4:28 pm

I believe the long ones are for the disc calliper and the short ones are for the rear drum brake set up -after 3 years its hard to remember :?: :?: :?: ---ed
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PostPost by: dusty » Fri Apr 24, 2009 4:38 pm

I had reason to bleed the brakes on an MG midget recently using the two man method. Went round all four wheels scratching my head as to why no air or fluid was coming out before I realised my "helper" was pumping the clutch pedal :?
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PostPost by: patrics » Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:55 pm

Nico,

Sorry but what ever you have brought to bleed your brakes throw it away this an easy job just doing it the way it?s always been done ? with a tube and a bottle and a friend.

First make sure the bleed screws aren?t blocked.
Starting with the brake / bleed screw closest to the master cylinder
Open the bleed screws only a ? of a turn ? enough to release the pressure
For the person / friend in the car push the pedal firmly to the floor
Lock the bleed screw off before telling the friend to release the pedal
Repeat above until no air is visible in the bottle.
Move to the next nearest brake to the master cylinder and repeat
Through out bleeding make sure the reservoir remains full.

You can do more but shouldn?t be necessary.

Rule number one ? never contaminate your brakes with any grease or fluid that?s not standard brake fluid.

Rule number two ? spend money on beer for friend?s not stupid things to bleed brakes.

Regards
Steve
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PostPost by: dusty » Sat Apr 25, 2009 8:59 am

I was always taught to start with the bleed screw furthest from the Master Cylinder.
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