Lotus Elan

Fuel line from tank to pump

PostPost by: JJ66 » Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:08 am

Dear all,

I am cleaning my fuel tank and rebuilding the original AC fuel pump on my +2. The supply line from tank to pump looks to be the original part in a black plastic, about 5/16" diameter. I am replacing all the flexible rubber hoses from pump to carbs with new ethanol proof tubing, but was wondering whether or not the original plastic line was OK to re-use. It looks fine and is undamaged, and also looks to be an interesting job to try and replace with the body in place!! Thanks in advance for any advice. Jonathan
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PostPost by: 2cams70 » Mon Feb 08, 2021 12:13 pm

Unless abraded or physically damaged in any spots it's fine. Don't make the mistake of replacing it with an inferior material less suited to the application. Suggest to run a wire through it and/or blow it through with compressed air to ensure it isn't full of muck though.
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PostPost by: JJ66 » Mon Feb 08, 2021 12:32 pm

2cams70 wrote:Unless abraded or physically damaged in any spots it's fine. Don't make the mistake of replacing it with an inferior material less suited to the application. Suggest to run a wire through it and/or blow it through with compressed air to ensure it isn't full of muck though.


Hi there, thanks for the reply, I definitely intend to put the air line on it tonight with a white cloth over the other to catch anything that might come out! Thanks again, Jonathan
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PostPost by: jonsered 11 » Mon Feb 08, 2021 11:36 pm

Hi Jonathan,

in your post you mention ( ethanol proof tubing), do you have the name of the supplier, as I'm in the process of doing that very job at the moment?

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PostPost by: JJ66 » Tue Feb 09, 2021 7:46 am

jonsered 11 wrote:Hi Jonathan,

in your post you mention ( ethanol proof tubing), do you have the name of the supplier, as I'm in the process of doing that very job at the moment?

Jonsered


Hi Jonsered, yes certainly, the people I am buying the hose from are Car Builder Solutions, their website is www.carbuilder.com. They sell a wide range of stuff and have the Gates hose listed (which had been recommended in the past) at around £6.60 per metre but they also have the fully ethanol proof hose which is £12,00 per metre, but well worth while if the car stands for periods of time like mine does. The standard hose capable of withstanding up to 10% ethanol is fine if the fuel keeps moving, but when it sits for weeks, or a couple of months, then I believe it may still eat into the rubber, hence I'm not taking any risks for my car and going with the best hose I can! They also have a good range of breather hose and so I bought 1/2" ID breather hose to replace my tank breathers, I am going to link the two main breathers and run the large bore pipe into a fitting (yet to make) in the filler neck, then with a reducing T-Piece I will run a small bore pipe through one of the existing breather tubes to provide pressure breathing with much smaller bore to reduce the fuel smell that always greets you in the garage! Hope you find the right hose and good look changing it - totally the right thing to do, you hear about cases where old hose has split with disastrous results, I know of a very nice TVR that was a total loss last year due to this issue. Cheers, Jonathan
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Tue Feb 09, 2021 8:48 am

If the Fuel Pump is next to the Engine the line between Tank and Engine is under vacuum. If you put an Electric Pump in the Boot the Line is under pressure.
This will determine what type of Fuel Line you fit also :wink: :wink:
Alan
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PostPost by: 2cams70 » Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:08 am

Your best bet for rubber fuel hose is to check the SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) number on it. If it doesn't have an SAE reference number don't buy it. There's a number of different SAE standards depending on the application the hose is intended for. If it does have an SAE number use Dr. Google to find out if it's the correct specification for your usage. Agree Gates is a good brand for hose - check the SAE number though. If it's not for the correct application it will still fail regardless of brand.
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PostPost by: JJ66 » Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:10 am

alan.barker wrote:If the Fuel Pump is next to the Engine the line between Tank and Engine is under vacuum. If you put an Electric Pump in the Boot the Line is under pressure.
This will determine what type of Fuel Line you fit also :wink: :wink:
Alan


Hi Alan, Yes indeed, I'm keen to leave the semi-rigid plastic pipe as it is stiff enough not to collapse under vacuum. I am staying with originality and keeping the engine driven AC pump, its probably not the best but it'll be OK for me!
Cheers, Jonathan
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:06 am

Hi JJ66,
on my 1972 Sprint i still have the original Fuel line and AC Pump and no problem.
on my TVRs with electric Pumps in the Boot i have fitted "Kunifer " Tube between Boot and Engine because of pressure.
The big problem with a +2 Elan is the Banjo for the Fuel Outlet at Tank which collects sediment. You can extend the length of the Banjo Special Screw so it doesn't suck Fuel from the bottom. Maybe 1 cms higher can help.
Alan
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PostPost by: JJ66 » Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:44 am

alan.barker wrote:Hi JJ66,
on my 1972 Sprint i still have the original Fuel line and AC Pump and no problem.
on my TVRs with electric Pumps in the Boot i have fitted "Kunifer " Tube between Boot and Engine because of pressure.
The big problem with a +2 Elan is the Banjo for the Fuel Outlet at Tank which collects sediment. You can extend the length of the Banjo Special Screw so it doesn't suck Fuel from the bottom. Maybe 1 cms higher can help.
Alan


Hi Alan, Yes, I used large bore Kunifer on my TVR's and it worked well. Excellent point about the Banjo, thank you for that, I did have to clean a load of rubbish out of it (its quite a small bore) and raising the tube element into the tank is a great idea, I will look into extending the existing bolt or making a new one. Good plan. On a related subject, I have rebuilt my AC pump with modern diaphragm and valves (supplier assures me it is compatible with fuels containing up to 10% ethanol, fingers crossed!) but I can't for the life of me find a supplier for the oil seal that runs on the diaphragm pushrod to separate 'engine' and non-pressure side of the pump. The seal that's in there is just about OK but has gone a bit hard and it would be better to replace it, any ideas? Thanks, Jonathan
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PostPost by: jonsered 11 » Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:52 pm

Hi Jonathan,

thanks for that...... I will get some from Carbuilder!

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PostPost by: JJ66 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:29 pm

JJ66 wrote:
alan.barker wrote:Hi JJ66,
on my 1972 Sprint i still have the original Fuel line and AC Pump and no problem.
on my TVRs with electric Pumps in the Boot i have fitted "Kunifer " Tube between Boot and Engine because of pressure.
The big problem with a +2 Elan is the Banjo for the Fuel Outlet at Tank which collects sediment. You can extend the length of the Banjo Special Screw so it doesn't suck Fuel from the bottom. Maybe 1 cms higher can help.
Alan


Hi Alan, Yes, I used large bore Kunifer on my TVR's and it worked well. Excellent point about the Banjo, thank you for that, I did have to clean a load of rubbish out of it (its quite a small bore) and raising the tube element into the tank is a great idea, I will look into extending the existing bolt or making a new one. Good plan. On a related subject, I have rebuilt my AC pump with modern diaphragm and valves (supplier assures me it is compatible with fuels containing up to 10% ethanol, fingers crossed!) but I can't for the life of me find a supplier for the oil seal that runs on the diaphragm pushrod to separate 'engine' and non-pressure side of the pump. The seal that's in there is just about OK but has gone a bit hard and it would be better to replace it, any ideas? Thanks, Jonathan


Hi Alan,

Further to the above post, and in preparation for extending the banjo bolt, I checked inside my tank and find that the threaded boss is actually standing proud from the bottom of the tank already (by about 10mm) and so should give me some protection without having to extend my bolt, see below:

Petrol Tank.jpg and


Do you think I should still extend up beyond this? You can see that I have de-rusted and sealed my tank with the POR-15 sealant, so I'm expecting it to be a lot better now. I have added a fuel filter also (glass and rebuildable) so I can see if any nasty stuff is trying to get through.

Thanks again, Jonathan
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PostPost by: alan.barker » Mon Feb 15, 2021 6:57 pm

Looks ok to me.
I used a 3 part treatment on a TVR 3000S with good results.
Alan
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PostPost by: JJ66 » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:02 pm

alan.barker wrote:Looks ok to me.
I used a 3 part treatment on a TVR 3000S with good results.
Alan

Hi Alan, Yes, same, I used the three part treatment but gave it two rounds of de-grease and phosphoric acid (Metal Prep they call it), the phosphoric acid was fine to use twice and has done a good job. Fingers crossed that we're all OK now. I'm just re-rooting the breather system in line with all the points raised in another current thread - Very timely!

Thanks, Jonathan
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