Lotus Elan

Oil pump compatibility?

PostPost by: The Veg » Wed Mar 11, 2020 3:20 am

Just a quick follow-up, the new pump is on and now I'm intimately familiar with the engine-mounts! :mrgreen:

For the filter, I wanted the biggest filter I could hang on the pump and ran into something interesting. Searching on Corrina instead of Lotus (on the hunch that the Corrina will produce more listings), the rather large Motorcraft FL-1A was listed. This is a big filter that is made for big Yank V8s, and it has the same thread and gasket sizes, but I found that it would NOT fit because its large outside diameter fouled with the sump-flange. If it was a quarter-inch narrower it would probably just barely work.

The next best choice I could find was a VW/Audi size with which I'm a bit familiar as both of the Mk IV VWs took this size. Same thread and gasket, and the body of the thing compares favourably to the size of the old cartridge type.
Attachments
IMG_20200310_222056__01.jpg and
1969/70 Elan Plus 2 (not S) 50/2036
"It just wouldn't be a complete day if I didn't forget something!" -Me
User avatar
The Veg
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 1594
Joined: 16 Nov 2015
Location: Atlanta 'burbs (southeast USA)

PostPost by: rgh0 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 3:26 am

I am surprised the VW filter has the same threads as I would believe they would be metric not imperial. I have heard of people using metric threaded filters by mistake as they can be screwed on but they fail and blow off under pressure as the threads do not fully engage.

cheers
Rohan
User avatar
rgh0
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 7572
Joined: 22 Sep 2003
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPost by: The Veg » Wed Mar 11, 2020 2:47 pm

It does actually have the 3/4-16 thread, and is a size that comes up in the Cortina search (and cross-references with some Frams mentioned in threads I found in this forum's archive, but I've seen the insides of Fram filters and refuse to use them).

As to why it's used in VW applications, I can only guess but I have some hunches. VW is known for keeping a lot of basic specs the same over decades, for instance every VW/Audi engine back to the beginning of the liquid-cooled era (1974?) has the same bellhousing pattern. This filter does show up in a search for a 1977 Golf, the first-generation VW I-4 and it also fit the 2002 GTI I used to have even though that engine was .3l larger and turbocharged. The second hunch is that it was an existing filter-spec when VW started designing their modern engines and may have been a common spec at the time so they might have chosen it to make life easy. But just hunches, you'd have to ask some retired VW engineer or executive to know for sure.
1969/70 Elan Plus 2 (not S) 50/2036
"It just wouldn't be a complete day if I didn't forget something!" -Me
User avatar
The Veg
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 1594
Joined: 16 Nov 2015
Location: Atlanta 'burbs (southeast USA)

PostPost by: types26/36 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 3:44 pm

I can confirm the VW oil filters fit with no problems, I have been using on twin cams since the early 80's. I worked for VW for 20 years and started using them mainly because they had the anti-drain back valve which were needed on VW's with hydraulic tappets or you got a long rattle before they got pressure.
And before I am shot down I KNOW the anti drain valve is not really necessary on T.C. engines BUT I like the idea of them.
The early Golfs & Passat's (USA Rabbits?) all had these oil filters.
I only use the genuine VW oil filter because some of the after market filters do not have the anti drain valve.
I also tried another VW oil filter (from the Kombi/bus I think) because it had more capacity but it would not fit as it caught on the edged of the sump/block due to its wider dimensions. I always keep a stock of genuine filters and here is the wider filter that does not fit.
Attachments
20200311_153313_resized.jpg and
20200311_153446_resized.jpg and
20200311_153457_resized.jpg and
Last edited by types26/36 on Wed Mar 11, 2020 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Brian
64 S2 Roadster
72 Sprint FHC
User avatar
types26/36
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 3655
Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Location: U.K.

PostPost by: ericbushby » Wed Mar 11, 2020 3:54 pm

Hi all,
3/4", 16 TPI is the old electrical conduit thread before they went metric. I think I may still have a die somewhere.
There`s a piece if information that you will never need, but it does take me back to my apprenticeship in the 1950`s
Eric in Burnley
1967 S3SE DHC
ericbushby
Fourth Gear
Fourth Gear
 
Posts: 872
Joined: 13 Jun 2011
Location: east lancashire

PostPost by: vxah » Wed Mar 11, 2020 4:29 pm

Just to add to the technicalities of oil pumps, some newer engines have variable displacement pumps so that no energy is wasted recirculating oil you don't need. Makes good sense!
vxah
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 326
Joined: 08 Nov 2012
Location: Cambridge UK

PostPost by: The Veg » Wed Mar 11, 2020 6:53 pm

types26/36 wrote:The early Golfs & Passat's (USA Rabbits?)


The Golf was the Rabbit in USA (my mother had two of them) during the Mk I years, and the Passat was the Dasher in USA during the same time. But while the Golf became the Golf in USA with the Mk II, the Passat became the Quantum here in its second generation, then finally was a Passat like everywhere else from the third on.

In the early 2000s a 'Rabbit' version of the Golf was briefly sold in USA, a budget-special that didn't sell well or last very long.

The Scirocco was always the Scirocco in USA but we never got the third generation. :cry:

Now back to Lotus!
1969/70 Elan Plus 2 (not S) 50/2036
"It just wouldn't be a complete day if I didn't forget something!" -Me
User avatar
The Veg
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 1594
Joined: 16 Nov 2015
Location: Atlanta 'burbs (southeast USA)

PostPost by: rgh0 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 7:31 pm

You learn something new everyday i will have to look for golf Mk4 oil filters now when searching for my Elan filters as no local autoparts suppliers stock Cortina ones anymore ! I actually have a stock of filters here for my sons Mk4 Golf R32 but they use a totally different cartridge style filter for their VR6 engine compared to the standard 4 cylinder.

cheers
Rohan
User avatar
rgh0
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 7572
Joined: 22 Sep 2003
Location: Melbourne, Australia

PostPost by: Davidb » Wed Mar 11, 2020 10:42 pm

I just fitted a Mann 719/12--noticed it says Volkswagen on the box. I asked the parts mann what VW it fits and he said Vanagon - up to about 1990 I think.
'65 S2 4844
Davidb
Fourth Gear
Fourth Gear
 
Posts: 871
Joined: 02 Jul 2009
Location: Vancouver, Canada

PostPost by: types26/36 » Wed Mar 11, 2020 10:53 pm

Brian
64 S2 Roadster
72 Sprint FHC
User avatar
types26/36
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 3655
Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Location: U.K.

PostPost by: The Veg » Thu Mar 12, 2020 2:21 pm

The one I used was a Purolator 20252, which should easily cross-reference to whatever brand you prefer or can get in your country.
1969/70 Elan Plus 2 (not S) 50/2036
"It just wouldn't be a complete day if I didn't forget something!" -Me
User avatar
The Veg
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 1594
Joined: 16 Nov 2015
Location: Atlanta 'burbs (southeast USA)
Previous

Total Online:

Users browsing this forum: Roland and 12 guests