Hot (not) starting

PostPost by: ricarbo » Tue May 29, 2012 10:08 am

You could check for 'no spark' by pulling of a plug lead, attaching it to an old spark plug, holding it on to the cylinder head with a bit of wood, then trying to start the car. One man job, if you have a solenoid with a rubber covered button between the main cables. If there is fuel in roughly the right amount and a spark, it should start............
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PostPost by: bast0n » Tue May 29, 2012 5:41 pm

Steve

When you say 'above your feet', do you mean inside the pedal box, on the cabin side of the bulkhead?



Yes - in the cabin above my feet on a simple bracket on the right hand side of the pedal box/footwell what have you. Just need longer leads and leave the old coil in place as a spare!!
Simples!!
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PostPost by: Steve G » Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:37 pm

I thought I should update this as following bast0n's sage advice I have relocated my ignition coil. It is now mounted where the horn compressor was (which is to be relocated to the other side next to the horns) so about 6 inches in front of the radiator and exposed to lots of nice cool air through the grille. Since moving it I have not had a recurrence of the problem. So, many thanks for your great advice bast0n.
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PostPost by: pauljones » Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:53 pm

Just a thought,

There seems to be a fair few of us lotus owners,myself included,that have had ignition related problems in a short space of time.Does that mean that components are not what they used to be?

If this is the case then surely an upgrade to coil pack electronic is the way ahead for keeping our cars on the road?

Thoughts at all?

Paul
Kick the tyres and light them fires...!!!!!!!
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PostPost by: Steve G » Mon Oct 07, 2013 9:54 am

Well, it's still going on and I think the problem may be my Lumenition power module. I have a brand new ignition coil and when the engine gets up to running temperature (around 90-95 degrees Celsius) I get a weak or no spark and it won't restart.

The RAC guy (That's like an AAA guy for the American readers) who came out did a spark test and found no spark on the plug or from the coil. He said it's most likely to be the ignition module, he even commented that if I had a good old points and condenser he could have fixed the problem. He said that the solder on the circuit board inside the module could have dry joints and when expanded once hot it breaks the circuit. This would also explain why my last coil was fried, apparently.

The module at the moment is right opposite the Webers and under one of the sock filters (a placement I've never been happy about and will be relocating if I decide to replace it). When I removed it after getting home it felt quite hot to the touch.

I'm not sure whether to buy a new Lumenition module at around ?100, go back to condensor and points ignition (I'm not averse to the idea of setting the point gaps once a year - a small price to pay for reliability) or go for a new system such a Petronix Ignitor: http://www.pertronix.com/prod/ig/ignitor/default.aspx

I like the idea of the Petronix system not being prone to heat damage and all being hidden under the distributor cap with no 'black box'. If anyone has this system I would appreciate hearing their experience of it. The Lumenition can't be more than five years old as the previous owner had recently fitted it I believe. I don't really want to spend ?100 on another one if it has a <5 year lifespan. I've done a bit of web based research and it seems the power modules failing is not a rare problem.
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PostPost by: RogerFrench » Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:31 am

I have Pertronix on Elan and Europa TC. No issues, much easier to live with.
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PostPost by: Steve G » Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:47 am

Thanks. Did you go for the Ignitor I, II or III system?
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PostPost by: Chancer » Mon Oct 07, 2013 7:12 pm

Something to add to the advice for restarting a hot flooded engine.

Throttle to the floor yes but do it very very slowly this way the accelerator pump will not throw another gobfull of fuel down the intake making your problem even worse.

twas always the advice back in the days of carbs.
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PostPost by: Steve G » Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:41 am

After careful consideration and following the advice of my friend Dan Lackey at CCK Historic I have decided to go back to points ignition. The reasons being I like being able to fix things myself, the original Smiths tachometer will work again (it currently overreads by 100% and bounces all over the place) and even with buying 'the best condensor, points and and rotor arm out there' ( http://www.swiftune.com/Product/535/swi ... enser.aspx ) it costs ?60 less than a new Lumenition power module, which I can't trust. My Lumenition rev limiter will still work and I"m going to relocate it behind the dash to keep it away from the engine heat, oil, fuel etc.

I'll update as to how I get on in case other people are interested or are having hot starting problems with electronic ignition.
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PostPost by: richardcox_lotus » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:38 pm

Foot to floor technique is only for Webers - not Dellortos or Strombergs....
Richard
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PostPost by: oldelanman » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:18 pm

richardcox_lotus wrote:Foot to floor technique is only for Webers - not Dellortos or Strombergs....

It's for all three carbs according to my S4 driver's handbook....
Roger
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PostPost by: AHM » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:06 pm

Steve G wrote:After careful consideration and following the advice of my friend Dan Lackey at CCK Historic I have decided to go back to points ignition.

Have you or he recently reminded yourselves how easy that is on an elan?

Steve G wrote:the original Smiths tachometer will work again

Will it?

And the tick-over will be all over the place.

I keep the points in the boot - would have loved to have given them to the RAC man and said "go on then"!
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PostPost by: collins_dan » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:37 pm

I used to have the same problems when I had a lumenition ignition. I changed to pertronix, put heat insulation on the fuel line going into the carbs and put a fuel pressure regulator as electric fuel pump was too high on its own. Never had the problem since. My pertronix is just the simple ignitor 1 under the cap. My start up routine has become turn the key first, then apply gas as needed. Generally, it starts on first crank if it has been driven in the last few days or minutes. Good luck. Dan
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PostPost by: Steve G » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:41 pm

My tick over is all over the place with electronic ignition. What are the special Elan issues with standard points breaker ignition? I'm going to be installing that little lot later so it would be useful to know.

I spoke to Miles Wilkins once and he led me to believe that all Elan problems stemmed from people meddling with the original set up. I think he might be alone in that opinion though.

The RAC man did seem to be quite knowledgable, even touched on Hall effect when I was asking about possible causes. I don't imagine he'd set the points up that well at the side of the road but if it just needed fixing...
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PostPost by: Steve G » Mon Oct 14, 2013 2:27 pm

Back on points. Gapped it to 15 thou and started on first twist of key (which it has never done cold before), idling steadier than before, feels like there is more power with a smoother delivery and it now starts on a hot engine. Got rid of all the nasty messy wiring too. Electronic ignition can sod off.

My tach is still over reading by 50% though? :roll:
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