Wizard Cooling Question

[Evante]

This question is for anyone who is running a Wizard aluminum radiator with two puller fans.

What is the running coolant temperature of your car?

I am running one of these radiators with an engine mounted fan and my coolant temp is in the 93-100c range. I am wondering if the temp would be lower if I had the two puller fans installed as opposed to the engine mounted fan.

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

JAS

[prezoom]

I am running a DYI 22" Wizard radiator in my Plus2. Single electric pulling fan, the biggest that would fit, with a standard thermostat for the Zetec 2.0L engine. Modified the radiator to a dual path coolant flow because of the water outlets location on the engine. I have never had the coolant temperature rise above 95c, even on near 40 degree days. I believe the thermostat is around 192f. The radiator is completely shielded so no air will bypass into the engine compartment, other than the air duct to the carb air box.

[Donels]

What thermostat are you using?

[mbell]

Under what conditions do you see that temp? Sat idling? Driving at high speed? Does it stay constant?

I'd expect the radiator should be more than enough for the heat generated by an Elan. So I doubt it a radiator/fan issue, unless you only get that temp when sat idling for long periods in high temps. Which then a second fan might be useful.

If you see that temp at other times then the issue is likely something else:
- Temp Gauge/Sender issue (aka false reading)
- Thermostat
- Air flow around the radiator
- poor coolant flow for some other reason
- bad timing/carb adjustment on the engine

To give any meaningful help we need to know much more about the situation when it gets hot.

[Evante]

Thank you for your responses so far.

We took the center out of the thermostat so as to reduce any restriction. No change.

At idle, the car runs at about 90c

Driving back roads in the 40-53mph range the car runs at 95.

Very spirited backroad driving 50-70 the temp runs 97 to 105. Generally closer to 100 but when stopping it will go higher until moving again.

Highway driving at 60-70 the temp runs around 100.

I have a Dave Bean cassette water pump, a McCoy conversion head, with weber 45 carbs. Timing is advanced to 32 above 3000 rpm.

There is also a 9 inch pusher fan on it with a 180 degree thermostat on the radiator and a mechanical fan on the engine.

Outside temps have ranged from 75-90F

Any other information that would be helpful?

I also have foam all around the radiator to block of air leakage.

[mbell]

It sounds like everything should be in order, the hot at high speed would suggests it not a radiator or fan issue to me.

How are you measuring the engine temperatures? The in dash gauge?

I would want to check with a separate thermometer if so. It could just be the gauge is in accurate and over reading and engine temps are fine.

If the temp have been confirmed accurate then I would be looking at items that would limit coolant flow. There few obvious things like collapsed coolant hoses (lower hose might be easy to restrict the flow on) but then it get harder like poor water pump performance or restriction inside the engine, either build up or maybe restrictive head gasket.

[Evante]

How would you go about checking the temp gauge for accuracy and checking the engine temp other than using the gauge?

[mbell]

https://www.harborfreight.com/121-infra ... 63985.html

Then you can compare temp between top and bottom hoses.

Or multimeter with thermometer feature, with sensor inserted into the top hose

[Chrispy]

How would you go about checking the temp gauge for accuracy and checking the engine temp other than using the gauge?

I had similar concerns on my Plus 2. The temp gauge would nudge 100degC sometimes which didn't seem correct.

I put my temp probe in a pot on the stove with wate. I gradually increased the temperature of the water and measured the resistance of the probe and the temperature of the water. This gave a resistance to temperature corelation.

I them put a variable resister on the input of the temp gauge in the car and determined what resistance showed what temp. I then added a resister to the sensor cable which corrected the temperature at ~85degC. Mine was out by ~15degC.

[Donels]

Something doesn’t sound right to me. The fan cuts in at 180f which is 82C, so it must be running all the time + you have an engine mounted fan. When you stop the temperature increases until you start moving again??

That suggests a lack of cooling flow which shouldn’t be a problem as you have two fans. Are you sure the electric fan is going in the right direction.

[Evante]

Let me try to address the above suggestions.

1. The electric fan is rotating in the correct direction. (Just checked with a piece of paper and it is drawn into the fan)

2. The thermostat for the fan goes on at 185 F (my mistake).

3. Temp checks:
When the gauge was 94c, I used an infrared temp gauge on the top hose where it come out of the thermostat housing, it was 89.5c.

The top of the radiator was 59c

The bottom hose was 48c

The fan, which should be going on at 85c was on.

Even though I could not measure the temp of the water directly, it seems as if the radiator is working but engine temp is higher than would be expected. Yes or no?

JAS

JAS

[Andy8421]

Running a mechanical fan is a waste of HP. The mechanical fan is sized to keep the car cool at tickover, and at high speed the airflow through the radiator should be more than sufficient to do the job - so at speed the fan is redundant, but is drawing more HP at much higher revs than at tickover.

Difficult to get reliable figures (it depends on size and pitch of the fan), but there are websites that suggest a mechanical fan will draw between 10HP and 20HP at 6000 rpm.

I appreciate this isn't helpful given your current problems, but when you have your cooling issue sorted, I would ditch the mechanical fan.

[Donels]

Assuming the gauge tapping is adjacent to the thermostat housing then there appears to be something amiss between the housing and top of the radiator.

Gauge reading 94C, thermostat housing 89.5C would seem to be about right, but a drop from 89.5C to 59C to the top of the radiator is far too great. I would expect to see a minimal drop. There should be nothing to give that level of temperature difference. Either the top hose has a major restriction or there is something wrong with your radiator.

[Evante]

I am going to have to look into these things further and will update you all as I go.

Also, I put the fan on the engine only to see if would reduce the overall temp, and if did by about 10 degrees c.

JAS