Lotus Elan

Wiper Motor S3 - mounting photo please.

PostPost by: englishmaninwales » Wed Jan 01, 2014 1:09 pm

I have been tracing a fault (intermittent power and loss of parking), hopefully now resolved, waiting for new park switch and brush plate.
It is a 2 speed 14W round bodied type as opposed to the square bodied type. The motor was cable tied to the mounting lugs (along with a relay that looked like it came from a WW2 submarine which got really hot and will be deleted), and although it appeared secure, I have a mounting band and rubber block on order and intend to mount it correctly to the 3 lugs on the mounting plate. However it is proving difficult to see how it will fit.
Anybody with an S3 or S4 out there with the glove box off able to take a picture?
(I did wonder if this is the wrong type of wiper motor for the car?).

Would like to fit a modern relay too. What type should I get ?

BTW really worthwhile extracting the rack from the wiper wheel boxes, cleaning off the 47 year old solid grease and re-greasing!

Thanks
Malcolm
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PostPost by: stugilmour » Thu Jan 02, 2014 7:01 pm

I think the second diagram is what you are after if you wish to use modern Bosch-type block relays to supply power to the motor separate from the dash switch? The required relays are made by a variety of manufacturers. They generally have a diagram printed on them to identify the contacts. The contact numbering system is standard between manufacturers. Second link below show the diagrams for the various relay types.

http://www.vitessesteve.co.uk/LucasStuf ... wiring.htm

I have not examined the circuit closely to make sure it works with your switch. The switch is important to make sure the parking function works correctly. At any rate, the circuit above uses the relay type often called "5-blade changeover" or simply "changeover", where pin 87a is the normally closed (NC) contact and 87 is the normally open (NO) contact. This type of relay may also be referred to as a Single Pole Double Throw (SPDT).

I have a Plus 2 that came stock with the two speed W14 or W16 motor (can't recall which off hand). I opted to just wire the wiper circuit without power relays. Instead, I added an aftermarket intermittent wiping relay that works with the stock two speed switch, but I don't think this is what you are after?

The other use of a relay in the wiper circuit is to allow the parking circuit to work correctly without the Lucas switch. That is the first diagram near as I can figure. Might be what you are after? In any case, it also uses a changeover relay.

A couple of on-line sources for relays. They are also generally available at an auto supply store.

http://www.autoelectricsupplies.co.uk/p ... ategory/36

http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.eu/V ... relays.php

You mention a relay in place that looks pretty old. Is it a Lucas-style metal can type? If so, this link may help you ID the contacts. They use a different terminal naming convention, where 'Winding 1' and 'Winding 2' (W1 and W2) trigger the relay and 'Contact 1, 2, & 3' (C1, C2, & C3) are the switched terminals. These are electrically similar to the Bosch-type, so really your option if you prefer to use this one.

http://www.autoelectricsupplies.co.uk/p ... tegory/113

http://www.autoelectricsupplies.co.uk/f ... iagram.jpg

Quick adder. Given that your wiring system will be non-standard, would recommend using relay sockets for any Bosch-type relays you add. This prevents wiring reconnection errors if and when you have to disconnect the relays for checking or replacement. Here is a variety of holders; they all have space for five pins even if the particular relay is a four pin type...

http://www.vehicle-wiring-products.eu/V ... ockets.php

HTH and hope not too confusing. First step I suppose is to confirm what the relay is doing in the circuit now,the configuration of your dash switch, and whether the motor is stock or a mod.

Stu
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PostPost by: types26/36 » Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:03 pm

englishmaninwales wrote:Anybody with an S3 or S4 out there with the glove box off able to take a picture?
(I did wonder if this is the wrong type of wiper motor for the car?)Malcolm


I found a picture of the wiper motor on my late S3 from when I had it apart, dont know if this will help you but as you can see it is the square type motor with the mounting closest to you and It is not wired through a relay.
Attachments
S3 WIPER MOTOR (Copy).JPG and
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PostPost by: oldelanman » Fri Jan 03, 2014 3:17 pm

There is an illustration in my '72 edition of the workshop manual (section M page 79) which shows the round bodied motor mounting. My S4 is the same as that. View from below.......
Wiper motor 002.jpg and
Wiper motor.jpg and
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PostPost by: englishmaninwales » Fri Jan 03, 2014 7:38 pm

Thank you all for the information, pictures and links. All extremely helpful. Looks like I have a bodge fitment of a later S4 wiper motor. Incidentally I have also a 4 position wiper switch with an integral push for wash. Is this also a non standard fitment for an S3? I think it it provides off/single wipe/slow/fast, but I 'll know when I wire up the whole setup on the bench when the wiper motor parts have arrived.
Malcolm
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PostPost by: types26/36 » Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:05 pm

englishmaninwales wrote: I have also a 4 position wiper switch with an integral push for wash. Is this also a non standard fitment for an S3? I think it it provides off/single wipe/slow/fast,Malcolm


I dont think that is correct for an S3, it sounds like you have a switch for another one of the Ford vehicles.
As far as I know it should have a variable speed switch operated by turning the knob to the right which switches it on getting progressively faster the further right it is turned.
The washer pump is a manual pump operated by pushing in the knob.
This is how it is on both my S2 & S3.
Here is a pic of the correct type of switch/pump.
Attachments
WIPER SWITCH.JPG and
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PostPost by: englishmaninwales » Sun Jan 05, 2014 3:32 pm

Thanks Brian. Yes it looks like the set up on my S3 is not standard! However, the two speed plus single wipe and electric wash in a period Lucas switch is in keeping and is practical, so I will keep that as it is, along with a modern relay.
As ever thanks for all the help.
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