Stranded for Christmas

[Robbie693]

Hello and greetings of the season to all.

Short story: I have a non operating starter, solenoid clicks but no action from the motor. Starter has about 300m on it from replacement . The lights stay bright when I turn the key. I have battery voltage at the positive side of the solenoid and about 0.6v less on the starter side when trying to crank (tested with the meter on the solenoid pole and engine). When I operate the solenoid the voltage across the pins drops to zero. I tried shorting across the solenoid with a jump lead and there was no effect. The engine can be turned over by pushing in gear and I can turn the starter with a spanner on the end shaft. Does this sound like the starter is dead?

Long story: Car has been with Paul Matty for a while this summer and they reported an intermittent issue that the starter solenoid just clicked sometimes but usually resolved itself second try. After getting the car back I had no such issues and put it down to a lack of use before it went to PM. As the weather has got colder I have found the engine rather sluggish to start which I would normally put down to cold oil but on Christmas day the engine barely turned over despite only last being used 10 days previously. It caught on the last gasp from the starter and off we went. I was uncomfortable doing this as I have bust a tooth off a bendix in the past in a similar situation but when I reached my destination I switched off and restarted no problem. When I tried to start it later I just got the click. I tried all the checks above, took the solenoid off and warmed it up a bit (desperate), charged the battery but to no avail. The starter is a remanufactured Lucas unit from Powerlite and although it has been on the car for 18 months or so has only been driven for about 300 to 400 miles and churned a bit while doing compression tests so I would have thought it should be ok. I haven't done the shorting across the solenoid poles before but assume it should spin the motor when doing this with the ignition on regardless of the solenoid failing or not(?).

Any ideas?

Cheers

Robbie

[h20hamelan]

I have run two ground wire to my chassis, one from battery ground, one from starter bolt.

Is it more moist out these days. Could condensation be hindering contacts.

[George S L]

First thing I would do is try a known good battery

[Andy8421]

Hello and greetings of the season to all.

Short story: I have a non operating starter, solenoid clicks but no action from the motor. Starter has about 300m on it from replacement . The lights stay bright when I turn the key. I have battery voltage at the positive side of the solenoid and about 0.6v less on the starter side when trying to crank (tested with the meter on the solenoid pole and engine). When I operate the solenoid the voltage across the pins drops to zero. I tried shorting across the solenoid with a jump lead and there was no effect. The engine can be turned over by pushing in gear and I can turn the starter with a spanner on the end shaft. Does this sound like the starter is dead?

Yes - assuming that the two events in bold above can happen simultaneously. There is always the possibility that the engine earth has broken / fallen off, but your - "I have battery voltage at the positive side of the solenoid and about 0.6v less on the starter side when trying to crank (tested with the meter on the solenoid pole and engine)" - test would indicate that the engine earth is OK. I would suggest you take the starter off and check it on the bench.

[RichardS]

Some more suggestions here

viewtopic.php?f=38&t=45329

I rewired my starter circuit as suggested, as it was wired straight through the ignition switch. I am now using the redundant solenoid on the bulkhead as a relay to trigger the starter motor feed. I have only done a few miles since so can’t comment on whether it has solved my intermittent starting problems.


Richard

[2tmike]

+1 for George's suggestion, I had a similar issue and this only takes minutes to do .....

[alan.barker]

Hi Robbie,
maybe if you remove the Earth Screw in the Boot that goes through the Chassis.
Remove completly from Bobbin as this clamps to the Chassis for the Earth. Good clean so it all shines.
Costs nothing and can do no harm only good
Alan

[2cams70]

As a test take the battery out of the boot and using two heavy guage jumper leads connect the positive direct to the solenoid and the negative direct to a hard point on the engine block. If the car then starts normally under these conditions you've isolated your problem to be excessive resistance across the main battery wiring going from the boot to the engine bay.

[oldchieft]

It takes not much time to try the stuck brush test

Hit it a few times wit a hammer

Turn the square on the back if you have one

Hit it again, and try it.

If it fixes it take the motor off for a refurb

Jon the Chief

[Robbie693]

Thanks all for the replies, I now have a few more things to check, although it's looking like a starter failure as no one has mentioned the possibility of the solenoid being the culprit. I don't quite understand why the voltage across the solenoid contacts drops to zero upon cranking but electrics were never my strong suit.

At least I am now fairly quick at removing the starter, having done it a number of times over the past few years!

Happy new year to all, here's to a better one coming

Robbie

[mbell]

The voltage drop across the solenoid being zero is correct behavior, indicates both sides are at the same voltage (e.g 12.3 - 12.3 = 0). Which is what you'd expect for a good solenoid.

[Robbie693]

Ah! of course, that makes sense. Thanks Mark

Robbie

[Robbie693]

Sorted, dead starter was the culprit, now replaced and back on the road.

Thanks for all the replies

Robbie

[h20hamelan]

will you rebuild your dead one?

[Robbie693]

The dead one is with the remanufacturers for assessment. They are a bit concerned it has failed in such a short space of time. Depending on the outcome they have offered to fix it and return it for me to have as a spare should I need one

Robbie