Lotus Elan

1965 Lotus Elan S2 on BaT SOLD

PostPost by: SGO 2F » Fri Feb 26, 2021 8:53 pm

No Reserve: 1965 Lotus Elan S2

SOLD FOR $45,000 ON 2/26/21
Richard Shetler
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PostPost by: elaninfuture » Fri Feb 26, 2021 10:22 pm

How do you guys feel about that price for that car? I'm no expert on Lotus values. More knowledgable on the Porsche market. Early Porsches do very well on Bat. Same for early VW. I've sold air-cooled cars on BAT and always been more than satisfied with the results.

My uneducated sense of the BAT market for Lotus, however, is that it's a crap shoot. I'd feel pretty secure selling a VW or a Porsche with no reserve. Not so much with a Lotus. I've never bought a car off BAT, but it seems like Lotus cars are one of the few that sometimes wind up being a deal. What do you think?
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PostPost by: 1owner69Elan » Sat Feb 27, 2021 12:53 am

elaninfuture wrote:How do you guys feel about that price for that car? I'm no expert on Lotus values. More knowledgable on the Porsche market. Early Porsches do very well on Bat. Same for early VW. I've sold air-cooled cars on BAT and always been more than satisfied with the results.

My uneducated sense of the BAT market for Lotus, however, is that it's a crap shoot. I'd feel pretty secure selling a VW or a Porsche with no reserve. Not so much with a Lotus. I've never bought a car off BAT, but it seems like Lotus cars are one of the few that sometimes wind up being a deal. What do you think?


I wouldn't put a nicer Elan for sale on BAT with no reserve. Too much variability. Witness the recent, very solid, Sprint that only got to $30k (RNM). That would have been a catastrophe for the seller.

In general, no seller seems to recoup their restoration costs, especially if work was done by a specialist or unless the seller doesn't count his/her own labor. But that "underwater" situation is not restricted to Elans.
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PostPost by: lottex » Sat Feb 27, 2021 7:07 am

I think you're missing an important point. The restored S2 ( and the S2 project that also sold well this week) were both “no reserve” auctions. Once a buyer focuses on a car they think they might buy cheaply, they're often hooked and the bidding continues.....It can be a risky strategy but clearly it paid off twice.
Conversely if you list with a “safety net” reserve, any buyer knows they're never gonna get the car at a giveaway price and there’s immediately less interest. Moreover, glitzy restored cars often sell well to perhaps less informed buyers on BAT!
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PostPost by: Certified Lotus » Sat Feb 27, 2021 12:16 pm

I think the value of the S2 was correct. What scared people off was the conversation initially about the accident it was in and the real possibility of a bent chassis. The chassis issue got resolved by showing the restoration pictures (although there were two areas of dents in the chassis) and it seemed like the replacement front clip was done appropriately. This car was a very nice example and who ever bought it got a good deal.

I’ve restored three Elan’s, two frame off. They are simple but delicate cars. The early Elan’s (S1 & S2) are beautiful and handle extremely well. The value of them is way under appreciated.

Regarding getting your complete restoration investment back, almost impossible on a Lotus. I tell everyone, buy a well restored Lotus as you will never be able to do it yourself for less money. I’m always shocked at what people pay for a “barn find” thinking they will restore it back to new for very little $$$. Especially the basket cases.

No reserve is a leap of faith. Personally I would never do that. I listed my frame off restored Lotus Europa on BAT last year and it didn’t hit the reserve. I would have freaked out if it sold below what I wanted for it.
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PostPost by: joesailor » Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:35 pm

I have been watching how the few early Elan's on BAT are doing. My Elan is currently listed here and I am considering putting it on BAT later this year. There does appear to be more price swing on the Elan's than other cars like the air cooled Porsche's or even say Aston Martin. I agree that a no reserve listing seems like a leap of faith for an Elan. The price for the one that sold seemed about right remembering you have to add the 5%.
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PostPost by: StressCraxx » Sun Feb 28, 2021 6:19 am

joesailor wrote:I have been watching how the few early Elan's on BAT are doing. My Elan is currently listed here and I am considering putting it on BAT later this year. There does appear to be more price swing on the Elan's than other cars like the air cooled Porsche's or even say Aston Martin. I agree that a no reserve listing seems like a leap of faith for an Elan. The price for the one that sold seemed about right remembering you have to add the 5%.
Joe
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Joe, I completely agree about selling on BAT. What I don't like is that BAT decides if it will have a reserve or not. In addition, they decide the reserve itself. If the car does not meet reserve, they have right of first refusal to take the car for reserve. I think it puts the seller on the back foot even before the auction starts....

Regards,
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PostPost by: nmauduit » Sun Feb 28, 2021 9:03 am

StressCraxx wrote:
joesailor wrote:I have been watching how the few early Elan's on BAT are doing. My Elan is currently listed here and I am considering putting it on BAT later this year. There does appear to be more price swing on the Elan's than other cars like the air cooled Porsche's or even say Aston Martin. I agree that a no reserve listing seems like a leap of faith for an Elan. The price for the one that sold seemed about right remembering you have to add the 5%.
Joe
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Joe, I completely agree about selling on BAT. What I don't like is that BAT decides if it will have a reserve or not. In addition, they decide the reserve itself. If the car does not meet reserve, they have right of first refusal to take the car for reserve. I think it puts the seller on the back foot even before the auction starts....

Regards,
Dan


that sounds like a leonine clause (a contractor sets a price and terms of sale, then gets the right to buy at said price), even in the US I have a hard time seeing a company standing by such rules..

so I checked their website : from the site FAQ

"
How do reserves work?

A reserve is the minimum price that a vehicle will sell for. We work with sellers to set reasonable reserves, and avoid vehicles with reserves that are not realistic. Reserve values are not shown on the listing, nor do we announce when reserves have been met (we think that leads to bidding games).
"

"The Post-Auction Process

If the auction reserve is met when the listing ends (or the auction is no reserve), BaT provides the seller and winning bidder with each others’ contact information.

The buyer and seller then work together to complete the transaction and arrange for shipping if necessary. BaT is happy to provide assistance or answer questions during this part of the process.

If the auction reserve is not met when the listing ends, BaT will provide the high bidder’s contact information to the seller in hopes that they can work out a deal."

https://bringatrailer.com/faq/#collapse-how-do-reserves-work

what is missing is whether all or part of the prepaid price is kept if no agreement is found on the reserve price... a feedback about the actual conditions of the conduct of the presale discussion setting the reserve price would be of interest, anyone from the forum to share his experience ?
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PostPost by: Certified Lotus » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:12 pm

I have only listed one car on BAT, my 72 Lotus Europa that I did a frame off restoration on.

Over all my entire experience with BAT was very professional and positive. When it came time to agree on a reserve price they wanted me to lower my reserve by $5K. I sent them the web link to my build thread on Europa site and after reading it said no problem on the price.

The auction went well, but only a couple of bidders. I didn’t reach the reserve and the car didn’t sell. BAT put the high bidder in touch with me directly and several months later he bought the car for what I wanted.

I look at it this way, you get National/international exposure at low cost and if the car doesn’t sell you will have lots of eyes on it for future sale.

So my suggestion to anyone who is trying to get a high reserve, make sure you have supporting documentation of why your car supports that value. Otherwise it will probably be declined.
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PostPost by: StressCraxx » Mon Mar 01, 2021 3:32 am

Certified Lotus wrote:I have only listed one car on BAT, my 72 Lotus Europa that I did a frame off restoration on.

Over all my entire experience with BAT was very professional and positive. When it came time to agree on a reserve price they wanted me to lower my reserve by $5K. I sent them the web link to my build thread on Europa site and after reading it said no problem on the price.

The auction went well, but only a couple of bidders. I didn’t reach the reserve and the car didn’t sell. BAT put the high bidder in touch with me directly and several months later he bought the car for what I wanted.

I look at it this way, you get National/international exposure at low cost and if the car doesn’t sell you will have lots of eyes on it for future sale.

So my suggestion to anyone who is trying to get a high reserve, make sure you have supporting documentation of why your car supports that value. Otherwise it will probably be declined.


Thanks, that's really good to know.
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