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Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:23 pm
by HCA
stugilmour wrote:Just coming late to this excellent thread. Just going through similar research for my Plus 2.

For an in-tank pump conversion, I like this kit. Called the Aeromotive Phantom Stealth 200. A bit spendy at first blush, but with the limited space in a Plus 2 I really like an in-tank design. Looks relatively easy to get a really nice install without odour issues. This kit is their universal fit version; the same company lists model specific pump & tank kits for popular American Muscle cars.

https://aeromotiveinc.com/product/phant ... el-system/

From my measurements I think it will work in a Plus 2 tank, but have not tried it yet. Not sure of the Elan tank dimensions. There are a few very good YouTube videos that show the installation process and some advantages. My tank is an Axminster aluminum replacement, but without the swirl pot stuff.

Edit: Here is a link to the product brochure that describes it pretty well

https://aeromotiveinc.com/tech-help/phantom/

Here is a link to the installation instructions (a bit difficult to get to directly on the company site)

https://aeromotiveinc.com/wp-content/up ... -0revE.pdf

A Google search on Aeromotive Phantom Stealth Installation will bring up several helpful videos. Although there are two sizes based on flow rate requirements (200 and 340), the install is similar.

Quick follow-up question. Does anyone know if their are any internal baffles or braces inside the standard Axminster tanks? Anyone got one handy that they can look inside thru the fuel sender hole?

HTH

Stu


I think this is a nice bit of kit and would answer many prayers. Let us know how you get on if you do buy it.

I cannot answer your baffle question - but why not call the manufacturer?

http://axminsterspecialistpanels.com/contact/

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:57 pm
by disquek
I'm using an Aeromotive Gen II tank in my conversion of my '65 mustang to EFI. I just got the tank and it will be a while before I'm ready to drive it. But I liked the design too.

-Kyle

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 12:11 am
by stugilmour
Excellent Kyle. Was hoping you would chime in.

I was making up an email to Andy at Axminster. Got a bit stalled as I don’t have the diameter of the sump piece to provide him. I will send off something shortly and report back.

Stu

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 12:18 am
by stugilmour
h20hamelan wrote:This level sender is in my +2 fuel cell, shorter one on the baby

https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/produ ... ecID=10320


Does that 0 to 90 ohm sender work with the stock Smiths gauge? That might provide a bunch more flexibility in locating the Phantom Stealth. The Plus 2 tank top is constrained by the hold down straps and the stock speakers.

Stu

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 1:01 am
by h20hamelan
I have only made provisions in the fuel cells thus far.
They will be made to work.

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:24 am
by disquek
My only concern about the Aerootive Gen II Stealth accumulator is that it has plain holes and not trap doors.

We'll see when I get it put together. But it'll be far better than just using the standard pick up in any pre EFI tank.

-Kyle

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 3:40 am
by stugilmour
disquek wrote:My only concern about the Aerootive Gen II Stealth accumulator is that it has plain holes and not trap doors.

We'll see when I get it put together. But it'll be far better than just using the standard pick up in any pre EFI tank.

-Kyle


Wondered about that as well. I think the theory of the case is as long as there is enough fuel to get fuel circulating on startup, there is so much fuel coming out of the return line and into the sump it rapidly fills up? Agree proof is in the pudding on that deal.

Stu

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:19 am
by HCA
May I impose on those who are using Jenvey [118mm] throttle bodies, and ask what you are doing regarding trumpets and airbox/filter?

Leoni [of Emerald] tells me that they have run out of the Emerald adjustable air trumpets, and sell Jenvey 90mm ones instead to Elan customers. However, these certainly will not fit into the standard airbox, and not even sure one could make an airbox to accommodate 90mm trumpets - my question is therefore, who has 90mm trumpets and how do you use them (yes, I can see if the car is purely racing how it works, but cannot see 90mms in a filtered air set-up)

My initial plan was to use the standard airbox with 40mm trumpets inside, with an elephant trunk down to the front attached to a KN conical airbox/filter. However, I just cannot stop the bonnet crushing the trunking, so was going to pack it all in and use pancakes but I'd have to lose the trumpets or, could I use an ITG airbox.

Might anyone have any other suggestions and/or how you have done it please?

thanks
Hal

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:00 am
by Andy8421
Hal,

Not much help I am afraid, but it generally isn't considered a good idea to use 'pancake' airfilters on an Elan. Colin was not known for spending money on a whim, but went to the trouble of the trunking and front mounted filter.

The reasons seem to boil down to:

The Elan engine bay is cramped, most of the air has gone through the rad and is hot. You want cold air for the carbs.

One choke per cylinder carbs suffer from standoff, which will soak your pancake filter in fuel. Not ideal above the distributor (not sure if timed EFI will suffer from this)

There is a small pressure pickup to be had by sourcing air from the nosecone where there is stalled air in front of the rad (not sure this makes much difference).

Pancake filters are noisy.

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:22 am
by sprintsoft
Technically I find this a very interesting thread but it seems to be for the already converted!

Can I ask the basic question “why go EFI?”

What are the key benefits given the large outlay in money and time to fit?

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:36 am
by HCA
Appreciate what you say Andy, and your points are spot on. The idea was a backstop in case I had not sorted out the elephant trunk being crushed problem. I think I have a solution for this now, but it involves a completely new airbox and a slight body modification, so a while off to implement...

Sprintsoft - you ask a very valid question! A short and obvious answer is that generally the benefits may not outweigh the cost - certainly when one already has a traditional motor in optimum condition, and certainly if originality is the end game, then injection is out of the question.

But why? Well, simplicity and reliability. Once EFI is set correctly, then no choke is needed and no tuning of carburettors etc. On the ignition side, correctly apportioned timing advance, no noisy distributer and best of all, no more points :lol: There are loads of counter comments to this and at the end of the day, it is what appeals.

For me, I am a compulsive messer, and EFI is made for me :lol:

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:52 am
by sprintsoft
Thanks HCA,

Could you say it delivers more bhp, or is more fuel efficient?

Does it give you a rock steady tickover?

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 12:03 pm
by HCA
As this is my first Twin Cam, I do not know! However, there at least two EFI owners on this thread whose answers I am interested to see :)

On an MGB tough, the answer is yes (a few more bhp), yes and yes. On an MGB with an 8 port Xflow head, a definite yes to all three!

Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2020 9:09 pm
by disquek
The answer to all things automotive, TIG welder and scrap aluminum! I think Kelvendon sells one like this. If it had it to make over, I'd have made it a little wider. But as it is, it's much wider than the stock airbox.

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Re: EFI solutions and comments

PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 5:52 am
by h20hamelan
HCA wrote:May I impose on those who are using Jenvey [118mm] throttle bodies, and ask what you are doing regarding trumpets and airbox/filter?

Leoni [of Emerald] tells me.

Might anyone have any other suggestions and/or how you have done it please?

thanks
Hal



https://www.merlinmotorsport.co.uk/s/it ... /ram-pipes