Lotus Elan

Restoration of S2 Elan - EOK

PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Thu Jul 30, 2015 12:44 pm

Well that was an interesting morning :roll: As it was a nice day we decided to take the Elan out for a nice long drive. Planned a trip of about 100 miles, the longest yet by some margin and set out. Everything going well, engine sounds great, but some popping and banging on the overrun still. On entering the outskirts of Totnes, a small country town about 30 miles from home, I noticed the temperature gauge rising to over 100 deg :shock: thought it a good idea to stop here and check things out so quickly found a car park by which time steam was coming from around the bonnet! Couldn't see anything immediately wrong although clear signs of splashed water everywhere, so left it to cool, went for a coffee and bought 4 litres of bottled spring water. Only the best for my Elan :lol: On our return began to check things out, but initially couldn't see the problem. Leant on the radiator whilst puzzling this one out and it MOVED ! Remember on an S2 the only restraint on the top of the rad is the pipe from the thermostat. The rad had vibrated loose and separated from the pipe!!! What an idiot :oops: although I blame the wire type circlips that hold the rubber pipe on, always afraid if they're too tight they will cut into the rubber. Anyway easy fix and refilled with ALL 4 litres of water. Cut short the trip and returned home with no further temperature problems. However my interior mirror began to vibrate loose too so that looking into it made me feel sick, and as we pulled into our drive the overtaking mirror, the type that fix to the window frame, fell off !!!!
An eventful day, but nothing that is not easily fixable. :lol:
Memo to self: when you have a nut, bolt or screw, MAKE SURE THE B***Y THINGS ARE TIGHT!!!!
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Tue Aug 11, 2015 7:41 pm

Just thought I'd share the latest on the project. We've used the Elan several times over the last week or so covering maybe 200 miles or more, including a trip to the local Club Lotus meet. The car is performing well up to expectations, bringing back all the fond memories of Elans gone by :D . She sounds glorious, feels tight, the steering is sharp and direct with great feel and the roadholding superb. Communication between the road and the driver is everything one expects, pretty much on a par with how my Elise felt ( well maybe a touch less, but nothing that an average driver would notice and you don't come much more average than me :mrgreen: ). But, of course you all know this already from your own cars, I'm not telling you anything that you don't already know, the Elan is simply an experience that cannot be matched, certainly not from a car that is exactly 50 years old in one weeks time :shock: :D She attracted much attention and many compliments at the CL meet, very satisfying! Just a couple of things came to light during the proceedings.........!
First the clutch. This has been a worry almost from the beginning, with the bite point too low for my liking. Well it seemed to get worse the more I used the car, sometimes giving me great difficulty in finding a gear quickly, but especially reverse. SO... I spent a long time reading past threads on here on bleeding the clutch. There seemed to be at least a half dozen "solutions", some that worked for some and some that didn't. Well I've tried virtually ALL of them :? Blocked the pedal and left overnight , nope!, completed the circuit by joining bleed nipple to MC, not sure!, two person manual bleed, nope!, raising the outlet from the nipple so that it was higher than MC, nope!, cracked the MC out and depress pedal, nope! Etc; Etc. Finally checked the push rod movement and thought I could get a bit more adjustment out of it, and...............that was it :roll: I can honestly say I don't know which of the above contributed the most to solving the problem, but I now have a firm clutch pedal, with the bite point about an inch and a bit from the top and a further 3 inches perhaps of real pressure. Happy with that :)
Secondly ( anyone dozed off yet?), the brakes take a lot of hefty pressure if I need to stop quickly. Brakes themselves OK, they recorded 104% at the MOT, but there isn't that initial reassuring bite that one has come to expect from brakes these days. I'm using new pads ( at least they were from my "stock" of new Elan bits) and were in a proper Lotus box, so assume OEM. I see people are using/ recommending Green Stuff and was wondering if these would be an improvement. Or are there any other recommendations? I used Mintex 1144s in the Elise and thought they were a vast improvement on OEM.
To summerise, the car is a joy to drive, I love it as much as my first S2 that I bought in 1968, I just don't drive it quite as fast as I did in those days .....er,..... er ...... :mrgreen:
Anyway, sorry to have gone on a bit, you can all go to bed now as I'm sure you're all feeling a bit tired :lol:
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: Elanintheforest » Tue Aug 11, 2015 9:17 pm

Great stuff Geoff.

The standard pads are usually too hard for a non-servo system, and give a very un-inspiring feeling to the brakes. If you haven't done it already, enquire with one of the normal suspects which are the best, and softest, pads to use with the non-servo setup. The difference is amazing, and of course, there were different pads for this setup originally.

Mark
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PostPost by: Quart Meg Miles » Tue Aug 11, 2015 9:46 pm

Great to hear you're actually driving it again, good work lad. Don't worry about the pads, let them bed in and you'll get used to the pressure and just push a little harder. The MoT isn't a very good guide, in my experience, though 104% does sound low, and I've always used normal pads from Fibreglass Serviles.

When I had a pedal which didn't increase the braking when it was pressed harder (but passed the MoT) it was because the rubber pipes had gone soft after changing the brake fluid, but you will have new pipes so that shouldn't be the problem. If you can lock the wheels don't worry, if not then use them harder than normal to wear them in for a while before panicking.
Meg

26/4088 1965 S1½ Old and scruffy but in perfect working order; the car too.
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Sat Aug 15, 2015 6:48 pm

As I was driving the Elan recently I noticed a vibration had started and was getting progressively worse. Not difficult to identify the source as the airbox was now resting on the footwell ! On examination I noticed that the engine mount on the carb side was the same as the one on the left. This hadn't bothered me too much during the rebuild as I'm sure I read somewhere that the mounts were the same on a Spyder chassis. However I saw the pic in Brian Buckland's book that clearly showed the modified higher mount fitted to the Spyder chassis. So, I ordered one of these from QED and it arrived today and I began to fit it. I'm used to jobs on an Elan being awkward, but this was on another level :evil: Anyway I finally got the old one out and this is what I found
SNV32812.JPG and


I'm not sure, but I think this was already fitted to the chassis when I bought it. If it was then it was new over 25 years ago although it's never carried the weight of an engine.The rubber looks perfect, not perished at all. It confirms the views of others I've read on here who have complained about the poor adhesion of the rubber to the metal.. Anyway I've struggled to fit the new one practically all day without any real luck as it's difficult to get the holes lined up. Any tips?
Just hoping I don't have to replace the other side any time soon and that the modified one doesn't make that side of the engine too high now :( Never a dull moment eh?
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Mon Aug 17, 2015 7:46 am

I set a target when I started the restoration of EOK that I would try to finish it by her 50th anniversary. On the 17th of August 1965 she left the factory in Cheshunt, so today is her 50th "birthday" . :wink: Target achieved. So altogether now...Happy Birthday to you, happy birthday to you.......... :mrgreen:

SNV32811.JPG and
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
Geoffers71
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PostPost by: Certified Lotus » Mon Aug 17, 2015 11:48 am

Nicely done! Congratulations!
Glen
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Tue Sep 22, 2015 11:28 am

Update to my S2 restoration, I've now finished the restoration of the hardtop and fitted it. All the usual issues with the prep of the fibreglass, stress cracks(not many actually), gouges and the front corners broken off needed to be attended to and then the paint. As I did with the main body, several coats of 2K primer rollered on and flatted back.
SNV32805.JPG and

SNV32808.JPG and

Then 4/5 coats of Cirrus White celly and much flatting back and burnishing up as before.
Drip rails and headlining then installed before the side seals, front and back rubber seals and the rear screen.
Then fit to the car.
SNV32817.JPG and

SNV32820.JPG and

SNV32822.JPG and


The headlining was a PITA to fit :evil: I had to peel it back 3 or 4 times to get the creases out and even then, after all was done I STILL had a crease or two than would not come out, tried gentle heat gun, everything, gave up in the end :twisted: :twisted:
I spent ALL of one day trying to fit the rear screen before giving up and calling in a local screen fitter. Took him 20 minutes :roll: I had fitted the front screen myself with little problem, but the rear screen rubber was a smaller profile and was a very, very tight. Well worth the 40 quid to have it done properly.
Anyway very pleased with the overall look. Bit reluctant to take it off again now :mrgreen:
Attachments
SNV32824.JPG and
SNV32813.JPG and
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
Geoffers71
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PostPost by: Elanintheforest » Tue Sep 22, 2015 10:06 pm

Looking very good Geoff.......how noisy is it driving the car with roof on compared to the hood?

I guess that the restoration is now complete, all bar a few settling-in jobs over the winter.....what's next??!!

Mark
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Tue Sep 22, 2015 10:35 pm

Thanks Mark, must be a bit strange for you seeing all those bits assembled into a finished car.
Yes, I think the car is noisier with the hardtop, but not troublingly so.
As you say I have just about finished, but I have relented and booked her into a local tuning place who have good experience of the Twincam and twin choke Webers. I have tried all I can, but can't get rid of the spitting and popping back that is worse on start up, but is still there when warmed up on the overrun. It sounds like a weak mixture, but I can't find any air leaks and I've tried enriching the mixture to little avail. I'm wondering if the SE cam on the inlet side plus the larger valves mean it needs larger jets. Anyway the tuner guy seems to know what he's talking about and he has all jet sizes in stock so we'll see what he comes up with. It'll be nice to see what power she's producing too :wink:
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Wed Oct 14, 2015 4:15 pm

Wow, she's a different car !!!!
Just got back from the tuners and I must say I was impressed with his work. Very methodical and thorough with full explanations at every stage. You will remember the trouble I was experiencing setting up the carbs/timing ( you don't?.....well do try to keep up :mrgreen: ) Initial investigations with the carb setup seems to indicate there was an overfuelling issue especially on No2 cylinder. Won't/can't go into all the detail but the initial dyno test was a shock....just awful......max power only 61 at the wheels :shock: and a very erratic curve.
After much time spent adjusting and retesting, including resizing the main jets from 110 to 115 and retiming the static advance from 22 (yes 22 !) to 14 deg BTDC the transformation was ...amazing.
Here's the two curves before and after...
SNV32840.JPG and

Needless to say the red is the before! :roll: Blue shows max power now 94.5, which I was told should equate roughly to 120 at the flywheel, maybe a bit more. Very pleased with that. This is mostly due to the SE cam and the bigger valves on the inlet I expect, so explains why bigger jets were needed and made such a difference.
Here's the power and torque curves
SNV32842.JPG and

Max power 94.5 hp and max torque 94.4 ft-lbs
Best power he got was 95 hp, but this was at a higher advance and so a compromise was made.
How do folks think these figures measure up with standard set-ups for both SE and Sprint?
Driving it back home was a revelation as I'm sure all would expect. Just bleddy marvelous :D :D Pulls like a train and no hesitation to notice. Sounding even better too.
Still a few pops on the gear change ( not unexpected I'm told as the throttles close), but otherwise a magical transformation.
The tuner did say there was potential for a tad more improvement, particularly as No 2 was still showing to be the weaker cylinder, if I had the carbs properly cleaned (ultrasonic and new jetting), but I'm happy at the mo. Might get that done a bit later.
Looking forward to your comments :mrgreen:
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: Spyder fan » Wed Oct 14, 2015 5:57 pm

Stick a Zetec in it Jeff.... 160 bhp at the wheels, no problemo!

Seriously, nice job and well done!!!

Alan

( very jealous )
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:14 pm

C'mon chaps where are all the usual helpful comments? :roll: :D . I'm particularly interested in views about the max power. Does anyone have an approximate figure for the transmission losses for an S2 fitted with standard do'nuts? Usually for a rear wheel drive car 15 to 20 % is quoted, which could give figures between 108 and 113 bhp at the flywheel, but I suspect the losses could be as low as 10 -12% in an Elan. Anyone any idea what the real figure for loss might be? I know it depends on a number of factors eg wear.
My chief reason for wanting to know is whether I should be looking for any more improvement by, for example, getting the carbs ultrasonically cleaned and new jets fitted. Still misses and runs on 2 or 3 cylinders for a few seconds when started from stone cold, and pops more than I like.
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: trw99 » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:30 pm

You need some of Keith Franck's magic kit. Go and view some of his latest postings on Side Draught Central. He's very nearly found Weber nervarna!

Tim
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PostPost by: 661 » Mon Oct 19, 2015 11:42 am

13% loss in the exige for a hub dyno, sorry, don't know the Elan figures nor for a rolling road, but guess your 15%- 20% is about right.
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