Lotus Elan

Restoration of S2 Elan - EOK

PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Sun Mar 29, 2015 6:40 pm

El-Saturn. Isn't this a bit off topic??? and I have no idea what you are talking about ! :? Things are clearly different in Switzerland, but here in the jolly old UK we don't have a 6 or 7 or even 8 year rule for the MOT. In fact our MOT is simply concerned with the roadworthyness of the vehicle. And if I was that concerned about the value of the car I'd have opted for the Lotus Chassis instead of the Spyder, although to be honest I'm not convinced it makes THAT much difference. Besides most Elans have updated parts, including chassis', so they're hardly original.
Sorry about my somewhat curt reply, but you've obviously touched a nerve. Can we get back on topic please, which is about what I'm doing to restore my Elan, the way I want it, liberally sprinkled with queries about how to resolve certain issues. Thanks :wink:
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: Quart Meg Miles » Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:25 pm

Geoffers71 wrote:Thanks Meg for your reply and the helpful suggestions (nice to know someone is reading my posts :D ). I have the popper screwed in as per your 'photo, the bit I'm talking about is the female part that the cant rail fits into, ...... you see what I mean about how the threaded part juts out into the car. It's obvious they've always been like that which made me ask if anything was attached to them. BTW mine seem to be much thinner walled, quite flimsy in fact when compared with yours,

The thread looks a bit clean to have been original :D and I think the flimsy look is an illusion as mine is only a 7/16" AF Nyloc nut over 1/4" UNF thread. I can't see any problem with cutting off your excess thread.
Meg

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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Tue Apr 07, 2015 8:19 pm

Began the process of fitting the underfelt today, by following the diagram supplied with the frog/toad/elephant/alligator skin rubber mat :roll: I was determined to take plenty of time about this as previous experience tells me it's so easy to make a complete cock up of it. For each section shown in the diagram I made a paper template and cut the felt a tad over size even then. The idea being I could make a final trim if necessary. One thing about the diagram that is puzzling, there is no felt shown on the back bulkhead between the body fixing bolts to the rear turrets, thus:-
SNV32691.JPG and

The 'gator skin diagram shows that it fits right across, but it doesn't seem to make sense that there's no felt under the central part. My inclination is to put felt there anyway. What have others done?
One thing that I think I have a solution to is the finish on the body edge between the alloy kick plate and the alloy rear trim and the door surround trim (see my thread under body etc). Thus;-
SNV32695.JPG and

I managed to buy a "U" shaped rubber seal like this, which has a 2 mm gap and is 15mm wide
SNV32694.JPG and


With a bit of trimming it was easy to turn it into the required "J" shape
SNV32693.JPG and

It's not finally fitted yet, but it looks OK already
Got to get into the footwells with the felt next, which I'm not looking forward to with MY back :(
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: FrancotTe » Thu Apr 09, 2015 8:32 am

Very nice as well,....very generous, good forums as well.
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Fri Apr 10, 2015 7:42 pm

Progress report coming up :D Underfelt is now fitted, absolute bu66er doing the footwell and the under dash, but done. So commenced fittng the "hide". No problems initially, but absolutely terrifed of trimming too much off the kit pieces and so much happier allowing an overlap where it looked OK. Started at the back as this seemed easiest, the first bits
SNV32702.JPG and


When it came to the large rear bulkhead piece, mostly vertical note, it seemed very reluctant to stick. Applied extra adhesive and left it overnight, but it still had not stuck, huge bubbles and it peeled away easily. Showed a piece of the hide to my local trimmer and he concluded that the surface of the hide felt slippy and in his opinion the cause of the problem. Remedy was to degrease the surface (brake cleaner is good) and to thoroughly abrade with coarse grit paper. Tried again and all is well, no problems with stickability :D
Decide to continue at the back with the alloy trim, so I had to finalise the rubber trim pieces
Glued in place
SNV32703.JPG and

Attach the ali trim. This comment is typical of a workshop manual, attach the trim :lol: :lol: Can't begin to tell you how tricky this was. I fitted the 4mm rawlnuts to the body, but the holes in the body did not coincide with the holes in the trim at all points, some did, others not, particularly the very end ones. After a great deal of fiddling I managed to get a fit of sorts
SNV32707.JPG and

SNV32706.JPG and

I'm not happy that the trim is not as snug up against the body at the ends as I would like, mainly due to the thickness of material in the sandwich. A note of caution to others here. I had decide to add a touch of luxury to the door surround panels by using a thin foam layer (headliner actually) under the vinyl.This looks great , BUT it's too thick a) under the rear alloy trim and b) under the kick plates. I had to peel back the vinyl in these areas and cut away the foam to reduce the thickness. It's still difficult, but JUST acceptable :(
SNV32709.JPG and

SNV32708.JPG and

Now to tackle the front pieces and those press studs :roll: :?
Last edited by Geoffers71 on Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: Quart Meg Miles » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:10 pm

Geoff, it looks fantastic!

My car doesn't have felt in that triangular area behind the tunnel but it will be quieter if you fit some. I fitted sound proofing under there when I rebuilt my diff (actually raised a thread on it) and I thought I'd gone deaf when I drove it again.
Meg

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PostPost by: Tahoe » Fri Apr 10, 2015 9:29 pm

Looks great! I did not put felt on the back bulkhead yet. I finished all vinyl except the rear. I did the tunnel areas first, then the front firewall area and the floors. Next I moved on to the sloped areas, and today started the rear bulkhead. I stopped to think about the possibility of felt on the rear bulkhead, but I don't think I'll do that. I only filled in the low spots and very carefully made sure I had a match between the tunnel and bulkhead pieces. The trim I made appears to fit and capture the vinyl very well. I have not cut/trimmed the aluminum piece on the ends yet and will try to do that in the end after I determine where it should end. I need to make the side panels as well, but do have a template.

Keep up the good work!
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Sat Apr 11, 2015 8:18 am

So Russ you didn't experience any problems with the hide sticking to the underfelt? Maybe you used a better adhesive, though mine was a heat resistant one provided by the trimmer. Hope you don't find the hide in a pile on the floor soon :lol: Interested to see how you solved the fibreglass edge trim next to the door surround trim and if you get it neater than I managed. Nice to have someone at the same stage as me to exchange notes :D
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: el-saturn » Sat Apr 11, 2015 9:33 pm

sorry - was just trying to convince you to go original: BECAUSE you may want to sell your car to a place like switzerland (for many an englishmans? and womans? most desirable place in europe) where a spyder /(even if superior) doesn?t even get the veteran plates which are "good" for 6 to 7 years, instead of 2 BECAUSE it?s simply NOT original! ..........................as far as I?m concerned I?d love to see carbon fiber / honeycomb tubs made for our elans - if somebody joins me, we?ll make a few: tony southgate and john thompson will certainly assist us (northhampton) ---------- the show must go on: have a look at a 2015 race anglia!! - greetings from racey switzerland sandy 36 4982: a 170 street legal horse and donkey power TC made partially in bristol (plus some tony t. suspension bits)
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Tue Apr 14, 2015 8:32 am

Just about finished the interior trim, here's a few pics :D
SNV32710.JPG and

SNV32711.JPG and

SNV32713.JPG and

SNV32714.JPG and

SNV32715.JPG and


One issue I have is the exact location of the seat runners. I've had new stainless ones made, but for some reason the original fixing holes in the floor are not visible even from underneath the car :? Can't imagine what's happened there. Can someone please give me a measurement for (say) the leading hole of the runner relative (say) to the seat location bobbin? Ta

Have to admit I'm pleased with the result, just have to wait for the seats to come back from the trimmers.
Next job is to rebuild the doors. I've already restored most of the bits to do the restoration, but I need the special top hat nuts and bolts that hold the interior handle on, like these;
SNV32718.JPG and

The Type 26 register doesn't have any, but I wondered if they are still regularly available from a normal nut & bolt supplier. Anyone have a source?
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: vstibbard » Tue Apr 14, 2015 10:58 am

Hi in response to your search for the top hats for the door glass handles, I've only found S1 sets from R Dent in US, I asked if he was able to sell the top hat and screw part only and answer was no.

I then looked into having both inner for S1 and outer for S1 and S2, these same parts (inner and outer appear to be sued on the S1 and S2 door locks to attach the inner handle to the lack assembly.

Challenge was minimum order of 200 and they were not cheap from memory worked out at close to $5/piece due to set up and programming costs for 500 came down to $3.50/piece, I suspect if I found someone in Asia they would be cheaper....

What level of interest is there to have even the short run made?

V
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PostPost by: Quart Meg Miles » Tue Apr 14, 2015 10:14 pm

Geoffers, on my RH drive car on both sides, from a line across the seat hinge bobbin centres, the door side seat runner front bolt centres are 7 3/8" behind the seat bobbins while the tunnel sides are 7 5/8". As the runners themselves are parallel and the bolts level it appears that the seats are slightly angled towards the front wheels.

Perhaps you can locate your existing bobbins with a powerful lamp beneath the car while it is dark inside.

(Please note my edited correction to earlier dimension allocations; apologies for the error)
Last edited by Quart Meg Miles on Thu Apr 16, 2015 11:13 am, edited 2 times in total.
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PostPost by: Tahoe » Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:46 am

Geoffers71 wrote:So Russ you didn't experience any problems with the hide sticking to the underfelt? Maybe you used a better adhesive, though mine was a heat resistant one provided by the trimmer. Hope you don't find the hide in a pile on the floor soon :lol: Interested to see how you solved the fibreglass edge trim next to the door surround trim and if you get it neater than I managed. Nice to have someone at the same stage as me to exchange notes :D

Lucky I didn't have any issues with adhesive. I couldn't find the exact adhesive that JAE recommended so I went with the same 3m brand but a higher adhesive number and it works great. I discovered that the fiberglass lip near the top by the door on my car was cut off at some point. I'll repair that later since it won't be real apparent once the side panel is on. I'm sort of at a stopping point right now even though I'm not finished, because I will be out of town for the next month except for a day here and there. Not far from home, but limited on time to do much if any work. Too bad because I need to drive the car ASAP or I'll go bunkers.
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PostPost by: Geoffers71 » Tue Apr 21, 2015 7:28 pm

I neeed a bit of assistance from those of you who have an S2. I've begun the process of assembling the doors. The door body has been fitted and the door locks, latches and windows are in
SNV32724.JPG and

SNV32720.JPG and

SNV32721.JPG and


So far so good. My problems start when fitting the frame for the arm rests. I can't work out the position of these relative to the bottom of the door. Common sense (can't say I've much of that left :D ) says this should be dictated by the black plastic thingy that aligns the dashtop to the door trim, here;
SNV32723.JPG and


If this is placed in position where I think it fits on the door, then there seems to be quite a large gap between it and the end of the dash. Is this right? Can someone measure this gap on their car and let me know what it should be? Also the height of the armrest above the bottom of the door.
Also the width of the steel armrest is less than the distance from the window channel to the inside edge of the door, thus
SNV32726.JPG and

SNV32727.JPG and

In the top picture the armrest is correct on the outside closest to the window, which leaves a gap on the inside. In the second picture the armrest is correct on the inside, but now there is a gap nearest the window between it and the vinyl covered trim (still to be fitted) that it will be connected to. Can someone tell me which is correct, or can i depend on the thickness of the foam backed vinyl to take up the gap?
I should add that the steelwork for the armrest and the bracket that connects it to the back trim came with the car and, I believe, was ordered from the Type 26 Register so it must be right! Right?
Hope someone can help, I don't want to have to guess this one. Thanks.
1965 Elan S2 (26/4726)
2002 Elise S2 (now sold :-()
1970 Scimitar GTE
"The older I get the better I was !"
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PostPost by: Quart Meg Miles » Thu Apr 23, 2015 9:48 pm

Geoff,

The gap between the front door moulding and the dash/crashpad is quite wide on my car, 5/8" to 3/4" car as there are a lot of tolerances to allow for.
129_2754 Door moulding to crash pad gap RH.JPG and

The metal armrest inner flange aligns with the door's flange as the hardboard panel attaches to both of them. Originally the join to the metal used split rivets fitted from the metal side but I reverted to countersunk screws fitted from the hardboard side. The attachment of panel to door was by Rawlnuts but they soon break and I use metal attached nuts (the name of which escapes me.

The height of the armrest is determined by the hardboard panel, which perhaps you don't have, and on my car measures 4 5/8" from the top of the trim down to the doors internal floor.
129_2757 Door panel height from inner fibreglass.JPG and

The curious bracket that the door handle attaches to is supposed to support the upper door panel but only attaches to the PVC sheet, using an Ali washer on the bolt head (the bolt sits inside a hole in the upper hardboard panel), a hardboard spacer and then the metal bracket and nut. The whole thing is unwieldy and I don't attach it though it means the large panel is held up by interferences and magic.
Meg

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