Engine Swaps

["Bob Layman"]

Are any others on this forum considering, or in process/completed,
an engine swap in your Elan? Basically, I have made up my mind to
do it but haven't decided between a 2L Zetec or 2L Duratec.

Quick summary: Zetec bolts up directly to existing clutch housings
and intake/exhaust are on the same sides as a twincam. Duratec,
being all aluminum, is lighter than a Zetec but requires an adapter
or new clutch housing (not yet available in aftermarket). Duratec
has more power potential (at least, naturally aspirated), but few
aftermarket performance goodies are available for it -- particularly
in the U.S. And, the intake/exhaust are reversed to a twincam.

Those with experience doing it, or knowledge of how to do it, please
come forth and share. I welcome all help on this undertaking.

TIA,
Bob Layman

[floods]

Hi Bob,

I have been considering the engine swap issue, I have a laid up +2S
130 which I intend to rebuild next year. Spyder
(http://www.spydercars.co.uk/)now offer a chassis conversion for a
Zetec engine and MT75 gearbox, it is a really good conversion
improving every aspect. However when you add it all up it is quite a
cost.

Therefore I decided to rebuild the twinky and add some modern
technology like Fuel injection. But the Zetecs are very good value.

So, its a hard choice do you stick with the old ways or new, having a
reliable everyday car is attractive but the purists will complain.

I would interested to see how you get on, keep in touch.

Sean Flood, UK
--- In lotuselan@y..., "Bob Layman" <formulabob@a...> wrote:

["Bob Layman"]

Got zero in the way of a response when I posted last week on this
subject. I still would like to hear from someone who has swapped out
the twincam for something more modern/reliable.

Original post (request) follows.............

Are any others on this forum considering, or in process/completed,
an engine swap in your Elan? Basically, I have made up my mind to
do it but haven't decided between a 2L Zetec or 2L Duratec.

Quick summary: Zetec bolts up directly to existing Ford clutch
housings and intake/exhaust are on the same sides as a twincam.
Duratec, being all aluminum, is lighter than a Zetec but requires an
adapter or new clutch housing (not yet available in aftermarket).
Duratec has more power potential (at least, naturally aspirated),
but few aftermarket performance goodies are available for it --
particularly in the U.S. And, the intake/exhaust are reversed to a
twincam.

Those with experience doing it, or knowledge of how to do it, please
come forth and share. I welcome all help on this undertaking.

TIA,
Bob Layman

[Martin_StuartUK]

I've no experience of this conversion, Bob, but I'm guessing it would be a whole lot easier if you used the latest version of the Spyder spaceframe replacement chassis as a basis for the work. This has been designed to acceptthe Ford 5-speed box out of the Sierra, so you'd only have to fabricate new engine mounts and deal with the usual issues like exhaust and plumbing. Spyder have also been doing the rounds with their Zetec converted Plus 2, sothey would be an ideal first port of call for advice on likely difficulties with the baby Elan.

I'd be inclined to go for the Zetec - as you say, there are plenty of tuning goodies for this engine and it is popular in the UK kit-car industry, so there is plenty of parts and expertise over here on the inline conversion.

Should be relatively straightforward (famous last words...).

Martin Stuart
----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Layman
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Wednesday, October 23, 2002 6:48 PM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Engine Swaps -- Repeat Request


Got zero in the way of a response when I posted last week on this
subject. I still would like to hear from someone who has swapped out
the twincam for something more modern/reliable.

Original post (request) follows.............

Are any others on this forum considering, or in process/completed,
an engine swap in your Elan? Basically, I have made up my mind to
do it but haven't decided between a 2L Zetec or 2L Duratec.

Quick summary: Zetec bolts up directly to existing Ford clutch
housings and intake/exhaust are on the same sides as a twincam.
Duratec, being all aluminum, is lighter than a Zetec but requires an
adapter or new clutch housing (not yet available in aftermarket).
Duratec has more power potential (at least, naturally aspirated),
but few aftermarket performance goodies are available for it --
particularly in the U.S. And, the intake/exhaust are reversed to a
twincam.

Those with experience doing it, or knowledge of how to do it, please
come forth and share. I welcome all help on this undertaking.

TIA,
Bob Layman

[lotusnut]

Hi Bob
A Mazda 13B rotary and 5 sp will fit. but I didn't do it. would yield
180hp w/carb. Good luck.

At 05:48 PM 10/23/2002 +0000, you wrote:

["berghapton2002"]

A Rover V8 and 5 speed will fitand the car goes quite well.

All alloy engine cast off by Buick

["berghapton2002"]

My Twin Cam is 1700cc, unleaded and running Fuel Injection.

Has someone purchased an alloy twin cam block and built a really
powerful unit

[holywood3645]

The Twinks big brother, A least what it developed into. A stroked
2.1 ltr BDG, alloy KAM 4 main bolt 90mm block, Farndon 82 mm forged
crank and rods, Hart modified BDG head, running on modest 48mm
dello's In the region of 275+ bhp at 11.1 CR, Dry sump, Weighing a
mere 160 lb. Forget those heavy V8's. I've got the engine, an S4,
but the poor bits will brake......

There is a John Sullivan who posts here, John has a BDP (240~260 BHP)
engine in his S3, with the bugs worked out. You should ask hime some
of the stories. It is amazing...... (they are pretty expensive) As
John said his main problem is stability above 145mph, the car with
gearing should hit 169.... NOT BAD FOR A 30 Year old car, and an
engine from the earily 80's. Forget the Zetec, Modify the T/cam head
fit an 90mm alloy block, and look for 180-200bhp. John Mc Coy will
make the head breath for you....

[Bill]

Bob

Why really bother if all is in good order. It works well as is particualry
if your Elan is sound order. T f--- it up asks for trouble and decreases
your value I think.

Bill 26/0538

[Elan45]

Only one long comment:

Don't be concerned about whether the engine will bolt up to existing g'box, since, if you are not striving for originality, why keep a box that only has 4 speeds and is getting hard to find parts for and was originally designed for a 37 HP Anglia, then was improved to allow syncro first and strengthened for the 1500 ncf engine of nearly 90 hp. But then, don't worry too much about the fact that you will then need a different propshaft, since you'll probably want to beef up the diff, also off the same family tree. Then, of course, you'll want CV joints and bigger brakes. But when you're finished, if you've done a good job, you may have a very exiting car. Also, you'llwant to swap those tiny 13" wheels for something at least 15". You might just consider money spent to be better off buying the M3, Honda S2000, new MX5 etc et al.

Roger



subject. I still would like to hear from someone who has swapped out
the twincam for something more modern/reliable.

Original post (request) follows.............

Are any others on this forum considering, or in process/completed,
an engine swap in your Elan? Basically, I have made up my mind to
do it but haven't decided between a 2L Zetec or 2L Duratec.

Quick summary: Zetec bolts up directly to existing Ford clutch
housings and intake/exhaust are on the same sides as a twincam.
Duratec, being all aluminum, is lighter than a Zetec but requires an
adapter or new clutch housing (not yet available in aftermarket).
Duratec has more power potential (at least, naturally aspirated),
but few aftermarket performance goodies are available for it --
particularly in the U.S. And, the intake/exhaust are reversed to a
twincam.

Those with experience doing it, or knowledge of how to do it, please
come forth and share. I welcome all help on this undertaking.

TIA,
Bob Layman













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[Foxie]

I was looking at Twincam/BDA alloy blocks at the Birmingham motor show a the year before last at Burton's stand. They will give over 2 litres, but the Burton man said the oilways are only suitable for dry sumping, and they would not work with the standard oil /sump system.

I can't imagine it's not possible, though.

Sean Murray
----- Original Message -----
From: berghapton2002
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 2:17 AM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Engine Swaps


My Twin Cam is 1700cc, unleaded and running Fuel Injection.

Has someone purchased an alloy twin cam block and built a really
powerful unit

[Deans Sprint]

What sort of output are you getting using fuel injection.
-----Original Message-----
From: berghapton2002 [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 2:17 AM
To: ***@***.***
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Engine Swaps


My Twin Cam is 1700cc, unleaded and running Fuel Injection.

Has someone purchased an alloy twin cam block and built a really
powerful unit

[Deans Sprint]

Would this set up fit into a +2. Or are we still going to need the spyder
chassis and Ford Zetec with Ford gearbox combo.
Has anyone done the Spyder conversion or bought the car. See what its about
in Classic Cars mag September 2002. Available on +441908 280600.
-----Original Message-----
From: DAVE [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 1:27 AM
To: ***@***.***
Subject: Re: [LotusElan.net] Engine Swaps -- Repeat Request


Hi Bob
A Mazda 13B rotary and 5 sp will fit. but I didn't do it. would yield
180hp w/carb. Good luck.

At 05:48 PM 10/23/2002 +0000, you wrote:

[Martin_StuartUK]

Really? Are you sure?? Have you seen one up and running???

The Rover V8 gearbox is *huge*, and the engine itself isn't exactly compact, so I'd be astonished if you can fit one into a 2 seater Elan without someserious modifications. Also, although the engine is relatively light compared to most American V8's, it's still a big lump of metal, especially with that gearbox attached,and I would expect it to upset the weight distribution and handling balance.

The 'Seven' type kit cars which have used this engine (eg. the Westfield SeIGHT) have suffered from cooling problems until a seriously uprated coolingsystem is fitted, too.

Then there's the question of whether the standard 155 section tyres could sensibly cope with all that weight and torque, so you could be into body mods to fit wider wheels...

Overall, quite a project, I would have imagined.

Martin Stuart
----- Original Message -----
From: berghapton2002
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 2:15 AM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Engine Swaps


A Rover V8 and 5 speed will fitand the car goes quite well.

All alloy engine cast off by Buick

[elansprint71]

About 25 years ago when I had my last Elan (68 S4 dhc, painted JPS colours
reg 74 JOH - anyone know where it is now?) in Manchester, there was a yellow
Elan with Rover "V8" badges on the front wings. One day the guy was getting
into it when I was passing so I pulled over and asked if I could look at his
engine- he told me to piss off and drove away! I could not tell from the
sound whether it was 4 or 8 cylinder, as I was suffering from shock!
I agree with Martin, it would be a bugger to fit, just look at the MGB V8
and that has a much larger engine bay.

Pete
----- Original Message -----
From: "Martin Stuart" <***@***.***>

Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: [LotusElan.net] Engine Swaps


Really? Are you sure?? Have you seen one up and running???

The Rover V8 gearbox is *huge*, and the engine itself isn't exactly compact,
so I'd be astonished if you can fit one into a 2 seater Elan without some
serious modifications. Also, although the engine is relatively light
compared to most American V8's, it's still a big lump of metal, especially
with that gearbox attached,and I would expect it to upset the weight
distribution and handling balance.

The 'Seven' type kit cars which have used this engine (eg. the Westfield
SeIGHT) have suffered from cooling problems until a seriously uprated
cooling system is fitted, too.

Then there's the question of whether the standard 155 section tyres could
sensibly cope with all that weight and torque, so you could be into body
mods to fit wider wheels...

Overall, quite a project, I would have imagined.

Martin Stuart
----- Original Message -----
From: berghapton2002
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 2:15 AM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Engine Swaps


A Rover V8 and 5 speed will fitand the car goes quite well.

All alloy engine cast off by Buick