power window +2

[rdssdi]

I will soon be reassembling my +2 doors. As the power window motors are
original, should they be replaced? They are Delco units and are quite slow. Where
can OEM replacement units be sourced?

Bob
1969 Elan +2

[Foxie]

Bob,

The problem with "slow" windows is usually the length and undersized of the wiring. Check your motors by by making a direct connection with good sized cables, you'll probably find there is nothing wrong with them. Then fit relays and heavy duty cable. Watch them fly up and down !

Sean Murray
----- Original Message -----
From: ***@***.***
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2006 10:47 PM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] power window +2


I will soon be reassembling my +2 doors. As the power window motors are
original, should they be replaced? They are Delco units and are quite slow. Where
can OEM replacement units be sourced?

Bob
1969 Elan +2












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["pigmaster78"]

Another cause of slow windows (at least in Europas) can be the window
sticking in the weatherstripping in the tracks. Make sure yours is in
good condition and pushed back into the track far enough not to bind
heavily on the glass.

Guy Arnos
'67 S3 Elan
45/7143
'70 S2 Europa
65/2400


--- In ***@***.***, "Sean Murray" <snmurray@...> wrote:

good sized cables, you'll probably find there is nothing wrong with
them. Then fit relays and heavy duty cable. Watch them fly up and down !

[stupidemail5 at lycos.com]

The grease is also hardened in the track. You wouyld be surprised how hard it is to move the window with the motor detached



--
_______________________________________________

Search for businesses by name, location, or phone number. -Lycos Yellow Pages

[paulatim2869]

Without being too stupid, where in the wiring (and what kind) of relays
would you suggest? My windows are very slow, but I think it has more to do with
the wiring than anything to do with the track. Is the issue more of a
grounding one, rather than power?

Thanks,
Tim McKay
Elan Plus 2
50-1601

[Foxie]

Tim,

If you look at the power to the window motors, the "up" power first goes to the ignition switch, then back to the fuse box, then back again to the window switch, and finally on to the window motor, through a number of bullet connectors that may have corroded and offer more resistance. Then the earth comes back from the motor to the dash to door pillar bracket, where there is a main earth cable. The original cable size is marginal (copper costs money, as Chapman would know !) The "down" power does not go through the igntion switch, but the cable size is again marginal.

If you take a heavy duty cable from the front fuse box front fuser (permanently live) split it behind the dash board to go to each door cable connection point, and mount two relays on each side here, and use the old power cable to switch the relays, you get full voltage at the motors, and the windows run up and down at speed. The relays are the common 12V 30A, four terminal type, two for the power in and out (contacts 30 & 87), and two for the switching (contacts 85 & 86). old power goes to 85, contact 86 is earthed.

You can check it out before actually fitting any relays by taking a direct supply in a good sized cable directly to the window motor connector inside the door.

Sean Murray

----- Original Message -----
From: ***@***.***
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 6:20 PM
Subject: Re: [LotusElan.net] power window +2


Without being too stupid, where in the wiring (and what kind) of relays
would you suggest? My windows are very slow, but I think it has more to do with
the wiring than anything to do with the track. Is the issue more of a
grounding one, rather than power?

Thanks,
Tim McKay
Elan Plus 2
50-1601












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[stupidemail5 at lycos.com]

relays will do nothing to speed the window, all they do is save the switch, which is not a failure point


running 14 ga or better wire in place of the factory bell wire will do the max and not require a month of work to repair the fire damage



--
_______________________________________________

Search for businesses by name, location, or phone number. -Lycos Yellow Pages

[rdssdi]

I have purchased new harnesses from Autosparks in the UK. I ordered several
modifications including larger gauge wires for the window motors.

My complaints for the window motor is based upon running it out of the car
without a load using a battery. It is very slow and draws a lot of current. As
I have already replaced every part in this restoration, new window motors
would be the least of it. I thought as they are Delco units they would be easy
to source.

Does anyone know what General Motors cars used the same unit?

Bob
1969 Elan +2

["John Stevens"]

Another thought on your slow windows - I have struggled with the same
problem for the 15 years that I've owned my +2. I've tried lots of
different things, including replacing window frames and completely
disassembling the motor and mechanism and regreasing it, all to no avail. I
was about to install relays, as you intend to do (understanding that the
relays weren't the good thing about this retrofit, rather the reduced
voltage drop gained bypassing all the miles of original wiring with some
short, fat wires was the end goal) when I wound up having one of the doors
off to replace worn out hinge bushings. As long as I had everything apart,
I decided to have one more go at cleaning and regreasing the motor and
mechanism. This time I used white lithium grease that came in a "toothpaste
tube" package from Permatex. Amazing! Problem cured.



John Stevens

Albuquerque, NM

'69 Elan+2



_____

From: ***@***.***lto:***@***.*** Behalf
Of ***@***.***
Sent: Saturday, April 15, 2006 10:20 AM
To: ***@***.***
Subject: Re: [LotusElan.net] power window +2



Without being too stupid, where in the wiring (and what kind) of relays
would you suggest? My windows are very slow, but I think it has more to do
with
the wiring than anything to do with the track. Is the issue more of a
grounding one, rather than power?

Thanks,
Tim McKay
Elan Plus 2
50-1601













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[Elan45]

The passenger side window on my SS Elan finallty quit working altogether
and I finally resorted to getting into the switch after numerous tests
showed it to be the culprit. Since sources for the switches are a
problem. I removed the switch from the dash, disassembled it, cleaned
all the inside contacts, reassembled it and reinstalled it into the dash
and now the passenger side is less problematical than the drivers side.
Yeah, while I was at it, I should probably done the drivers side too,
but to get the one done that I did, I had to make a special tiny stubby
screwdriver to get at the retaining screws and having to work by feel
and w/ a mirror image because I didn't want to completely remove the
dash from the car. So, since the same switches are used in +2s, you
should also clean the inside of the switches while your car is apart.

Roger



The problem with "slow" windows is usually the length and undersized of
the wiring. Check your motors by by making a direct connection with good
sized cables, you'll probably find there is nothing wrong with them.
Then fit relays and heavy duty cable. Watch them fly up and down !

Sean Murray
----- Original Message -----
From: ***@***.***
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2006 10:47 PM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] power window +2


I will soon be reassembling my +2 doors. As the power window motors
are
original, should they be replaced? They are Delco units and are quite
slow. Where
can OEM replacement units be sourced?

Bob
1969 Elan +2












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b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
***@***.***

c.. the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.


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[rgh0]

An easy way to clean dirty switch contacts which seem to be a
consistent problem in the lucas style rocker switches is to spray
inside them electrical contact cleaner while working the switch back
and forwards.

This cleans the built up dirt and grease of the contacts and restores
normal function without dismantling.

The spray cans come with a long thin pastic tube so you can normal
spray down the sides of the switch from the front of the dash and get
enough into the works to clean them up.

Rohan

[Elan45]

Rohan,

Ever since I sprayed contact cleaner on a plastic/metal connector on my
computer printer and watched it crumble immediately in front of my eyes,
I've kept contact cleaner away from plastics. Most people have no idea
what the plastics are that we deal with in everyday life nor what is in
the spray cans we use so easily. I'd sure hate to watch a switch made of
unobtainium melt in my hand from something I sprayed on it. We use a
good amount of engineering plastics in our shop and the one common
solvent that seems compatible is isopropyl alcohol. I'm sure you could
come up w/ a way of getting it inside the switch w/o dismantling it. If
one were afraid of never getting the switch back together right, if
nothing else, isopropyl is cheap enough, you could fill a cup and dunk
the switch. But I also wanted to make sure it wasn't a wear problem, so
I wanted to examine the contacts too.

Roger


consistent problem in the lucas style rocker switches is to spray
inside them electrical contact cleaner while working the switch back
and forwards.

This cleans the built up dirt and grease of the contacts and restores
normal function without dismantling.

The spray cans come with a long thin pastic tube so you can normal
spray down the sides of the switch from the front of the dash and get
enough into the works to clean them up.

Rohan












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[rdssdi]

The rocker switches used on The +2 and other Lotus cars are appliance style
switches. You can disassemble them but often they will break. They are not
made to service. Some people have done this but in my opinion the failure rate
would be high.

I believe that Dave Bean will have new rocker switches available. Call Ken
and ask him when they will be available.

I feel its just a matter of time until these 30+ year old switches need
replacement.

Bob
1969 Elan +2

[wgrainge]

Tim,

I just used four cheap 40amp Hella relays (about $7 each). Relays
must have 87a terminals. Then follow the wiring shown on the Elan
modified wiring diagram in the files section. I just did this to my
S4 and it works great.

-Will Grainger
45/9693

[Frank Howard]

In a message dated 4/18/06 08:17:27 AM, ***@***.***es:

<< The rocker switches used on The +2 and other Lotus cars are appliance
style
switches. >>

I read somewhere that the switches actually came from the manufacturer of a
British made washing machine. Truth or myth?

Frank Howard
'71 S4 SE
Minnesota