Lotus Elan

Differential problem

PostPost by: nygroup » Tue May 17, 2005 7:08 pm

Hi. My rear differential just went out on my 69 Elan +2 after push
starting the car. Can turn the drive shaft into diff with no resistance
at all with wheels on the ground, but no grinding, etc. Any guesses?
Any tricks on removing the differential (I'm planning on following
steps in shop manual). I'm thinking the spider pin may have dropped
out or sheared, which might mean simple repair if that's the case, once
I remove the diff from the car.

thanks,
steve
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PostPost by: gjz30075 » Tue May 17, 2005 7:30 pm

--- In ***@***.***, "nygroup" <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi. My rear differential just went out on my 69 Elan +2 after push
starting the car. Can turn the drive shaft into diff with no
resistance

at all with wheels on the ground, but no grinding, etc. Any guesses?
Any tricks on removing the differential (I'm planning on following
steps in shop manual). I'm thinking the spider pin may have dropped
out or sheared, which might mean simple repair if that's the case,
once

I remove the diff from the car.

Steve,
Good possibility, but check the stub axles first. They're known to
break and can be replaced with the diff in the car, albeit not easily.
Its probably just as easy to pull the diff. Comes out on the LH side,
if I recall. If the stub axle is broken, you'll come across those
first with disassembly.

Greg Z
'72 Sprint
Greg Z
45/0243K Sprint
36/5727 pre airflow coupe
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PostPost by: elansprint71 » Tue May 17, 2005 10:06 pm

Greg Zelazek wrote:

--- In ***@***.***, "nygroup" <[email protected]> wrote:
> Hi. My rear differential just went out on my 69 Elan +2 after push
> starting the car. Can turn the drive shaft into diff with no
resistance
> at all with wheels on the ground, but no grinding, etc. Any guesses?
> Any tricks on removing the differential (I'm planning on following
> steps in shop manual). I'm thinking the spider pin may have dropped
> out or sheared, which might mean simple repair if that's the case,
once
> I remove the diff from the car.

Steve,
Good possibility, but check the stub axles first. They're known to
break and can be replaced with the diff in the car, albeit not easily.
Its probably just as easy to pull the diff. Comes out on the LH side,
if I recall. If the stub axle is broken, you'll come across those
first with disassembly.

Greg Z
'72 Sprint

In addition to Greg's advice: if you do have to pull the diff out of the

car, get the car as high as possible before you start!

Cheers,
Pete.
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Location: Cheshire, UK.

PostPost by: "Peter Walker" » Tue May 17, 2005 11:27 pm

Good chance it is a broken stub axle. The originals don't seem that strong.

And if you are taking the diff out it can be a tight fit. At first it seems
like it won't come out.

I've pulled 2 of these and both times I had to use a lever to ease it out.

Peter
66S2
----- Original Message -----
> > Hi. My rear differential just went out on my 69 Elan +2 after push
> > starting the car. Can turn the drive shaft into diff with no
> resistance
> > at all with wheels on the ground, but no grinding, etc. Any guesses?
> > Any tricks on removing the differential (I'm planning on following
> > steps in shop manual). I'm thinking the spider pin may have dropped
> > out or sheared, which might mean simple repair if that's the case,
> once
> > I remove the diff from the car.
>
> Steve,
> Good possibility, but check the stub axles first. They're known to
> break and can be replaced with the diff in the car, albeit not easily.
> Its probably just as easy to pull the diff. Comes out on the LH side,
> if I recall. If the stub axle is broken, you'll come across those
> first with disassembly.
>
> Greg Z
> '72 Sprint
>
In addition to Greg's advice: if you do have to pull the diff out of the
car, get the car as high as possible before you start!
"Peter Walker"
 

PostPost by: Arno Church » Wed May 18, 2005 7:19 am

Could it not be a broken output shaft. If one is broken , and with an open ( ie not LS or locked) diff, you'll also be able to turn the input (prop) shaft
Arno
----- Original Message -----
From: nygroup
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 9:05 PM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Differential problem


Hi. My rear differential just went out on my 69 Elan +2 after push
starting the car. Can turn the drive shaft into diff with no resistance
at all with wheels on the ground, but no grinding, etc. Any guesses?
Any tricks on removing the differential (I'm planning on following
steps in shop manual). I'm thinking the spider pin may have dropped
out or sheared, which might mean simple repair if that's the case, once
I remove the diff from the car.

thanks,
steve








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PostPost by: cusword » Wed May 18, 2005 8:54 am

Exactly this happened to me last September, when push starting the
car. It transpired it was a broken diff output shaft. I replaced
it without removing the diff, and it was easier than I expected. The
first thing is to figure out, is which side the problem is, which is
not as easy as you think, as diffs are funny things. After removing
the rotoflex coupling, I removed the circlip retaining the bearing,
and knocked out the output shaft. I could then see the break, and
could see the other section still in the diff. To my surprise I
could pull it out with my fingers. The break was not at the
splines, but it was an early shaft where they 'turned down' the
centre section, and the break was at the 'radius root', as you might
expect. On later shafts they did not 'turn down' the centre section.

I hope you find this is your problem.

Regards,

David

Hi. My rear differential just went out on my 69 Elan +2 after push
starting the car. Can turn the drive shaft into diff with no
resistance

at all with wheels on the ground, but no grinding, etc. Any
guesses?

Any tricks on removing the differential (I'm planning on following
steps in shop manual). I'm thinking the spider pin may have
dropped

out or sheared, which might mean simple repair if that's the case,
once

I remove the diff from the car.

thanks,
steve
cusword
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Posts: 145
Joined: 01 Jan 2004

PostPost by: "Roger Sieling" » Wed May 18, 2005 12:31 pm

Steve,

Greg's/ Peter's advice is good. Check the stub axles first.

Since your're going to get the back of the car up in the air anyway, put the gearbox in neutral, then go under the back of the car and turn one rear wheel then the other. More than likely, turning one wheel will cause the propshaft between the diff and gearbox to turn, while the other won't. I had this same problem just last spring. The side which doesn't turn the propshaft is the broken side.

I have a short stub axle slide hammer to allow me to pull the stub axles inthe car. You could make one too. I'll send you a photo if you wish. I was very lucky in that the stub axle in my car broke very cleanly. It was not atorsion failure which results in a twisted stub axle, which then fails in a whole bunch of dirty little pie shaped fragments. In a clean two piece break, you could replace the stub axle w/o any other work. But, if it's a torsion failure w/ lots of broken pieces, the diff has to come out, come apartand be spotlessly cleaned. There is too much chance that a fragmet will remain inside and get lodged in between the gear teeth and destroy the CWP.
I also have a pot type strong magnet, about 3/4" in diameter mounted on a long screw (maybe 4" long) that I use to pull out the broken piece(s) after the stub axle/bearing has been removed.

Good luck,

Roger

>> ***@***.*** 5/17/05 7:29:12 PM >>>
Good chance it is a broken stub axle. The originals don't seem that strong.


And if you are taking the diff out it can be a tight fit. At first it seems
like it won't come out.

I've pulled 2 of these and both times I had to use a lever to ease it out.

Peter
66S2
----- Original Message -----
> > Hi. My rear differential just went out on my 69 Elan +2 after push
> > starting the car. Can turn the drive shaft into diff with no
> resistance
> > at all with wheels on the ground, but no grinding, etc. Any guesses?
> > Any tricks on removing the differential (I'm planning on following
> > steps in shop manual). I'm thinking the spider pin may have dropped
> > out or sheared, which might mean simple repair if that's the case,
> once
> > I remove the diff from the car.
>
> Steve,
> Good possibility, but check the stub axles first. They're known to
> break and can be replaced with the diff in the car, albeit not easily.
> Its probably just as easy to pull the diff. Comes out on the LH side,
> if I recall. If the stub axle is broken, you'll come across those
> first with disassembly.
>
> Greg Z
> '72 Sprint
>
In addition to Greg's advice: if you do have to pull the diff out of the
car, get the car as high as possible before you start!







To search the mailing list archives:
http://www.escribe.com/automotive/europ ... index.html



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PostPost by: nygroup » Tue May 24, 2005 8:24 pm

Yes, it turned out exactly as described by David. Left side Output
shaft broken clear thru between splines and outside end of the shaft.
Splined piece slid right out. Had to use slide hammer to get the part
of shaft attached to bearing out, but fortunately, local Pep Boys
lets you borrow tools at no charge!

Getting the doughnut bolts out was a challenge, but compressing the
spring on that side helped. I'm replacing both side output shafts
with used Sprint shafts purchased from Dave Bean.

Thanks for all of the advice. Very helpful indeed.

steve






--- In ***@***.***, "david_cusworth"
<[email protected]> wrote:
Exactly this happened to me last September, when push starting the
car. It transpired it was a broken diff output shaft. I replaced
it without removing the diff, and it was easier than I expected.
The

first thing is to figure out, is which side the problem is, which
is

not as easy as you think, as diffs are funny things. After
removing

the rotoflex coupling, I removed the circlip retaining the bearing,
and knocked out the output shaft. I could then see the break, and
could see the other section still in the diff. To my surprise I
could pull it out with my fingers. The break was not at the
splines, but it was an early shaft where they 'turned down' the
centre section, and the break was at the 'radius root', as you
might

expect. On later shafts they did not 'turn down' the centre
section.


I hope you find this is your problem.

Regards,

David

> Hi. My rear differential just went out on my 69 Elan +2 after
push

> starting the car. Can turn the drive shaft into diff with no
resistance
> at all with wheels on the ground, but no grinding, etc. Any
guesses?
> Any tricks on removing the differential (I'm planning on
following

> steps in shop manual). I'm thinking the spider pin may have
dropped
> out or sheared, which might mean simple repair if that's the
case,

once
> I remove the diff from the car.
>
> thanks,
> steve
nygroup
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Posts: 43
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