Sprint Colors.

PostPost by: elansprint71 » Mon Feb 21, 2005 9:50 pm

Yes the change in paint colours continues into the door openings, however the gold stripe just goes slightly round the corner as it is not long enoughto go all the way to the door seal.
The white is Cirrus white.
The white colour was applied in the mould, the other colour was sprayed on when the body was out of the mould, this is why it cost ?15 more for a car in single colour that for a twin colour Sprint, they had to paint the whole shell.
Am I the only person who knows how to look in the archives? No wonder so many old Elan.net folks do not bother to contribute to this forum any more.

Gary- this bad-tempered comment is not aimed at you, it's just that the same questions keep on being raised over and over- which side do the wipers park, why don't my carbs work, arrrghh- search in the archives, it's in therealready, well 99% anyway. End of rant.

Pete (stick off ice, fen dried out, time for a drink).
----- Original Message -----
From: Gary
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2005 8:13 PM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Re: Sprint Colors.



The bottom half color on an Elan Sprint is definitely Cirrus White.
(I wrote Lotus a few years back, and they have the bottom as Cirrus
White and the top as Carnival Red.)

Now I have a question... Does the defining line between the top and
bottom colors on an Elan Sprint continue into the door jamb and
around the door itself? (I just dropped my Sprint off at the shop
today to get the same paint job. My painter asked the question.) Can
anyone post a photo of this condition? Thanks!

Gary
'71 Elan Sprint Coupe
Miami, Fl

____________________________________________________________________
--- In ***@***.***, "Tony Vaccaro" <tvacc@l...> wrote:

" I am looking for the paint code for the WHITE that is on the
bottom of the > Sprint Elans."










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PostPost by: M100 » Mon Feb 21, 2005 9:57 pm

On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:02:54 -0000, "nebogipfel2004"
<***@***.***> wrote:


I have a feeling that all the old (26/36/45) Elan solid colours as a
2K mix are readily available from PPG in the UK - Mick Miller was
just down the road from their HQ (then ICI) and I recall he mentioned
in one of his lectures that he used their 2K paint on restorations.
Carnival Red and Cirrus White have been available in ICI 2K for a good
15 years now as I used them on my Sprint repaint (just don't tell the
solvent police)

Back in 94 when I ordered my M100 S2 the factory said they could
theoretically supply "any colour" via DuPont who used a colour
analyser to match up to samples provided by a customer. The only
example that immediately springs to mind is the shade "Cranberry Red"
that was individually specified in 95 and used on just two cars (an
Esprit S4 and an Elan S2 for a father and son respectively)


Martin
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PostPost by: nebogipfel » Mon Feb 21, 2005 10:10 pm

"The white colour was applied in the mould"

I am pretty sure my car was original and the white was sprayed on
Cirrus white, almost certainly cellulose?


If we all just search the archive this would be a pretty lifeless
forum.

Also, I have seen quite a bit of info quoted in sources such as forums
and books which is clearly incorrect.

I think it is good to hear new perspectives and I personally enjoy
reading most of it ;)

If Einstein had stuck to the archives we would still be basing
everything on Newtonian physics

John
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PostPost by: nebogipfel » Mon Feb 21, 2005 10:18 pm

Martin, As I say I can't comment on PPG paints as I have no local
supplier. I did not even realise that there was any connection between
PPG and ICI. In the good old days I used ICI cellulose exclusively. It
was by far the best product at the time ..... but that is many years
ago now.

I do think, as I may have hinted earlier, that often how much success
you may or may not have at a paint supplier is based on how much they
can actually be bothered! If it's not on the computer under their nose
....!

You are right in saying that often if all else fails a formula can be
derived from analysing the original finish (assuming you have one in
good condition).

John
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PostPost by: elansprint71 » Mon Feb 21, 2005 10:43 pm



I will now retreat into my cave until the next time someone asks about which car the ashtray came from.

Pete.
----- Original Message -----
From: nebogipfel2004
To: ***@***.***
Sent: Monday, February 21, 2005 10:09 PM
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Re: Sprint Colors.



"The white colour was applied in the mould"

I am pretty sure my car was original and the white was sprayed on
Cirrus white, almost certainly cellulose?


If we all just search the archive this would be a pretty lifeless
forum.

Also, I have seen quite a bit of info quoted in sources such as forums
and books which is clearly incorrect.

I think it is good to hear new perspectives and I personally enjoy
reading most of it ;)

If Einstein had stuck to the archives we would still be basing
everything on Newtonian physics

John









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PostPost by: Guest » Mon Feb 21, 2005 11:25 pm

Dear all

I must admit not knowing anything about this at all, but I will put my two bobs worth in any way.

I doubt that the gel coat finish straight out of the mould is good enough for any final finish especially for a car that cost what a Spint cost new.

I have rubbed my s3 SS back to gel coat and found lots of air bubble defects in the surface straight out of the mould. I would go for it being paintedno matter what the experts say.

Boy I must be feeling like being whipped again.

Rod

Rodney Stevens
CSIRO Minerals
http://www.minerals.csiro.au

Ph. 61 2 97106701
Fax 61 2 97106789

Personal Home Page
http://mywebpage.netscape.com/rodjohnst ... mepage.htm



-----Original Message-----
From: elansprint71 [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: Tuesday, 22 February 2005 9:45 AM
To: ***@***.***
Subject: Re: [LotusElan.net] Re: Sprint Colors.





I will now retreat into my cave until the next time someone asks about which car the ashtray came from.
Guest
 

PostPost by: mikecauser » Tue Feb 22, 2005 12:06 am

On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:44:53 -0000 "elansprint71" <***@***.***> wrote:


At the time the Sprints were made Miles had no interest in them
whatsoever. He was soley concerned with the earlier Elites. (And yes,
I did know him in person at the time.) OTOH he was a chemist before
getting into the Lotus restoration business, but I'm not at all
convinced he's right about this in-mould idea.

Nor, to pick up another thread, am I happy about the idea that
die-casting tooling was made for the TC head and then abandoned.
Die-casting is a very much more expensive process to tool up for than
sand casting, and I really don't believe that having made the tooling that
anyone would have dropped it easily.




Too true!



Einstein accepted Newton and, more or less, pointed out the extreme
cases where Newton's theories no longer worked. Newton simply threw
away the previous 3,000 years of theories and showed how mechanics
really operated within the confines of a solar system. (Caveats:
Kepler, Galileo, Laplace, and who was the mad Dane in the tower...?)


Now, the $64,000 question!

If Einstein & Newton had been able to buy a car in 2000 what would
they each have bought?


I see Einstein as a s/hand Citroen 2CV sort of man, but Newton I can't
decide between a Lexus and an Elise.....


BTW, I have been to Newton's maternal home, and seen some of his
posessions and the bed he was born in. I've also tried to read his
books, but my Latin isn't up to it, even if my physics is :-((


Mike
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PostPost by: M100 » Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:00 am

On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:44:53 -0000, "elansprint71"
<***@***.***> wrote:


I've had my doubts over this spray the mould idea for years. Like the
mythical Medici Blue did it ever really exist? The factory apparently
considered topcoat in the mould for the 90's Elan - there is a
reference in the Mark Hughes book but dropped it prior to production
when they couldn't get the finish right. Now consider this is around
20 years after the Sprint, using nickel plated moulds, VARI,
Fibreform, and chemical cure paints. I hazard a guess that the
conventional moulds used on the original Elan and the use of 60's
paint technology would mean lots of finish problems.....or perhaps a
lower quality standard (owners of 1990 Calypso Pink M100's might
disagree!)

You have a couple of wildly conflicting requirements if you spray
paint the mould, you need mould release so you need a wax or pva as
your first part of the layup, but you also need the good adhesion of
the (very non thixatropic) topcoat prior to the gelcoat being applied
for which you definitely don't need anything like wax - maybe pva is
better but as a side effect you will end up with a matt surface
finish. Is there a way around this other than lots of compounding -
the process was supposed to save time, if you have to compound you
might as well have painted in the conventional manner.

I would have thought Albert Adams would know this kind of thing more
than Ron though who was in semi retirement by the time the Sprint came
out, and Miles who surely was but a lad in short pants at the time -
but he has probably seen a fair few in his workshop since.

Martin
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PostPost by: elansprint71 » Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:35 am

Chris Harvey book:
"New paint scheme made the Sprint and the +2S 130 readily identifiable...... .... this was achieved by injecting paint into the glass fibre during the moulding operation, a process which Chapman hoped he would be able to use for all his creations."

Pete
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PostPost by: LotuSport » Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:50 pm

--- In ***@***.***, Mike Causer <mikec@m...> wrote:


Hi Mike -

Unquestionably an Elise. Anyone who would create something as
marvelously crafted and intellectually innovative as Newton's
Mathematical Bridge would certainly be driving an Elise today.

Best regards,
Bob
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<span style='font-size:9pt;line-height:100%'>Best regards,<br>_<span style='font-size:13pt;line-height:100%'><span style='font-family:Times'><i><b>Bob</b></i></span></span><br>______________________<br>[email protected]</span>
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PostPost by: davidallen » Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:20 pm

I have not looked recently, but the "metalflake" roof on the 130 may have
been made with this process?

David

-----Original Message-----
From: elansprint71 [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: 22 February 2005 08:37
To: ***@***.***
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Was Sprint Colors, now Sprint Colours.



Chris Harvey book:
"New paint scheme made the Sprint and the +2S 130 readily identifiable......
.... this was achieved by injecting paint into the glass fibre during the
moulding operation, a process which Chapman hoped he would be able to use
for all his creations."

Pete














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PostPost by: nebogipfel » Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:53 pm

"The white colour was applied in the mould"


I'm still inclined to say if Lotus relied on Gel colour I'll eat my
virtual hat.

As said in a previous post the hand lay-up was just too hit and miss
it would not have been anywhere near good enough. They may have
experimented with it but I bet they ended up painting them!

Gel colour looks horrible and ages badly too. You only have to look at
some of the kit car output.

Also ...... if they used gel colour why not on all the Elans with
solid colours?

John
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PostPost by: nebogipfel » Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:58 pm

"New paint scheme made the Sprint and the +2S 130 readily
identifiable...... .... this was achieved by injecting paint into
the glass fibre during the moulding operation, a process which Chapman
hoped he would be able to use for all his creations."


Nope, still don't believe it :)

Apart from anything else if your +2S 130 or Sprint was damaged it
would be very difficult to match gel colour with paint as the colours
produced would be so variable......... and just wouldn't look right

John
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PostPost by: tvacc » Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:00 pm

All I can say..is that they took down my car to the gel when they painted
it..and it was not white..



Tony V



_____

From: nebogipfel2004 [mailto:***@***.***
Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 12:53 PM
To: ***@***.***
Subject: [LotusElan.net] Re: Sprint Colors.





"The white colour was applied in the mould"


I'm still inclined to say if Lotus relied on Gel colour I'll eat my
virtual hat.

As said in a previous post the hand lay-up was just too hit and miss
it would not have been anywhere near good enough. They may have
experimented with it but I bet they ended up painting them!

Gel colour looks horrible and ages badly too. You only have to look at
some of the kit car output.

Also ...... if they used gel colour why not on all the Elans with
solid colours?

John











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99 Elise190, 05 Elise, 2005 MiataSpeed Turbo
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PostPost by: nebogipfel » Tue Feb 22, 2005 7:11 pm

In ***@***.***, "Tony Vaccaro" <tvacc@l...> wrote:
All I can say..is that they took down my car to the gel when they
painted
it..and it was not white..


Precisely!

I am actually arguing against gel colour Tony :)

John
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