Lotus Elan

Security systems

PostPost by: steveww » Mon Dec 20, 2004 4:30 pm

Not very secure as a wire can be run straight to the coil bypassing any
hidden switches and other imobilisers.

I still think the best option is a battery cut off locked in the boot
(trunk). These can be fitted with a bypass fuse which will keep any
clocks, radios etc running.

Richard Boyd wrote:
Advantage for electric fuel pump: it can be wired to not operate - as a
security device. Hidden switch, etc. Harder to figure out (and by-pass)
than hot-wiring an ignition.

Question: The standard simple-minded old-guy method is hidden switch that
grounds the points. Can this same circuit be used with optical/magnetic
ignition systems, like the Pertronix/Aldon Ignitor?

Rich Boyd








To search the mailing list archives:
http://www.escribe.com/automotive/europ ... index.html



Yahoo! Groups Links










--

Regards,

Steve Waterworth
***@***.***

Einstein: "The faster you drive, the slower you age..."
User avatar
steveww
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 1838
Joined: 18 Sep 2003
Location: Northamptonshire, England

PostPost by: M100 » Mon Dec 20, 2004 4:42 pm

On Mon, 20 Dec 2004 14:53:02 -0000, "Gareth Flanagan"
<***@***.***> wrote:

Ah...so you just did the imobilser bit......not bothered with the
tracker and all the other bits of gps nicked car location technology
gizmos....as for the method of starting...what about bump
starting...just leave it on a hill (pointing the right way of course)
just plug your battery disconector in and roll down the hill......
Lol

That's for everything (no GPS tracker) The pager transmitter and
microwave sensor are only a few ounces each. I still have the
Chapmanesque switch in the glovebox to add authenticity - but just
keep it away from any wiring.

The trouble with hills is there is never one around when you need one,
and if there is sods law says it's always pointing the wrong way. I've
done a bump start in reverse once - not in the Elan but in a very
early Mini with single cylinder front drum brakes and it scared me so
much I don't ever want to try again.

Martin

72/45

--
Martin
72 Sprint DHC
User avatar
M100
Fourth Gear
Fourth Gear
 
Posts: 766
Joined: 16 Sep 2003
Location: Yorkshire

PostPost by: garyeanderson » Mon Dec 20, 2004 10:46 pm

On S1 and S2 Elan's the boot lock is rather lame, I had a Europa
this Summer that I got with no keys (same locks), I needed to get
into the front and rear luggage bins and the rear was beaten without
damaging it the front boot needed a simple turn with a screwdriver
and I was in. I was concerned I would damage the fiberglass so I was
more careful than some one interested in stealing your car. The
europa also had the ignition lock and inorder to get it out of the
barn I simply removed the steering column clamp that secures the
collapsing column together and turned the wheels by hand. The biggest
problem was the four flat tires and locked up brakes. It still took 4
hours to load it onto the trailer.

--- In ***@***.***, Steve Waterworth <[email protected]>
wrote:
Not very secure as a wire can be run straight to the coil bypassing
any

hidden switches and other imobilisers.

I still think the best option is a battery cut off locked in the
boot

(trunk). These can be fitted with a bypass fuse which will keep any
clocks, radios etc running.
User avatar
garyeanderson
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 3128
Joined: 12 Sep 2003
Location: Massachusetts, U.S.A.

PostPost by: poiuyt » Tue Dec 21, 2004 2:09 pm

The previous owner of my S4 installed a race-type battery cut off
switch that is hidden. Turn this and nothing works.

If you are still using ignition points, install a hidden switch that
will ground the battery side of the points. This will ensure no spark
if the bad guys try to use a wire to bypass the ignition switch.
Don't do this if you have an electronic ignition.

Of course, a couple of guys can carry the car away because it's so
light! :-)

Steve B.


--- In ***@***.***, "Michael Geiger" <[email protected]>
wrote:

Anyone install a real security system in their Elan? If so, what
model, brand, etc. Is it even worth the expense and effort? Any
other opinions on doing this are welcome.

Mike Geiger
66 S3 Coupe'
Steve B.<br>1969 Elan S4
poiuyt
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 346
Joined: 23 Feb 2004

PostPost by: poiuyt » Tue Dec 21, 2004 2:51 pm

You cannot bypass a switch that puts ground on the battery side of the
points because, electrically, they never open.

Steve B.

--- In ***@***.***, Steve Waterworth <[email protected]>
wrote:
Not very secure as a wire can be run straight to the coil bypassing
any

hidden switches and other imobilisers.

I still think the best option is a battery cut off locked in the
boot

(trunk). These can be fitted with a bypass fuse which will keep any
clocks, radios etc running.

Richard Boyd wrote:
> Advantage for electric fuel pump: it can be wired to not operate -
as a

> security device. Hidden switch, etc. Harder to figure out (and
by-pass)

> than hot-wiring an ignition.
>
> Question: The standard simple-minded old-guy method is hidden
switch that

> grounds the points. Can this same circuit be used with
optical/magnetic

> ignition systems, like the Pertronix/Aldon Ignitor?
>
> Rich Boyd
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To search the mailing list archives:
>
http://www.escribe.com/automotive/europ ... index.html

>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

--

Regards,

Steve Waterworth
[email protected]

Einstein: "The faster you drive, the slower you age..."
Steve B.<br>1969 Elan S4
poiuyt
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 346
Joined: 23 Feb 2004

PostPost by: john.p.clegg » Tue Dec 21, 2004 4:05 pm

Don't they?

John


Steve B <***@***.***> wrote:


You cannot bypass a switch that puts ground on the battery side of the
points because, electrically, they never open.

Steve B.
User avatar
john.p.clegg
Coveted Fifth Gear
Coveted Fifth Gear
 
Posts: 5691
Joined: 21 Sep 2003
Location: Manchester

PostPost by: poiuyt » Tue Dec 21, 2004 9:44 pm

If you have a negative ground car and run a switch that puts ground on
the positive side of the points, they will physically open, but will
be shorted to ground by the switch. Thus, electrically they appear
not to open and there is no spark.

Steve B.


--- In ***@***.***, JOHN CLEGG <[email protected]>
wrote:
Don't they?

John


Steve B <[email protected]> wrote:


You cannot bypass a switch that puts ground on the battery side of
the

points because, electrically, they never open.

Steve B.





Steve B.<br>1969 Elan S4
poiuyt
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 346
Joined: 23 Feb 2004

PostPost by: Rob_LaMoreaux » Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:08 pm

If you have a negative ground car and run a switch that puts
ground on
the positive side of the points, they will physically open, but will
be shorted to ground by the switch. Thus, electrically they appear
not to open and there is no spark.


The only problem with this is that it will mean that as long as the ignition
is on there will be current flowing through the coil. So the coil will get
hotter and hotter as the battery gets drained away.

Personally I have a power kill switch installed under the door below my knee
which has a non-removable handle. I had a switch with a removable handle and
it was so unreliable I put the Lucas one on for a reliable connection!!!

I turn the switch off when I leave the car and I don't really worry. Most
people either don't know what the car is or respect it enough to not want to
take it from a good home. The ones that worry me aren't going to drive the
car off, but would tow it away so killing the ignition wouldn't matter. At
home the Elan sits next to a car worth a lot more and much more likely to
get stolen. I don't worry about someone breaking into my garage to steal the
Elan, since they'd take the new car first.

My future in-laws are the same way about their Alfa and it is much more rare
and worth a lot more than my Elan.

These cars are in a niche where while they are classics, they aren't the
muscle cars that the kids want to take for a joy ride, and they aren't rare
enough and worth enough for the pro to take it. Besides the close pedals
keep most people from being able to drive an Elan with their street shoe and
that works too! <grin>

Rob LaMoreaux

MTS Systems Corp.
Powertrain technology Division
4622 Runway Blvd.
Ann Arbor, MI 48108
734-822-9696
Fax 734-973-1103
Main Desk 734-973-1111
www.mtspt.com
Work email: ***@***.***
Home email: ***@***.***
Rob_LaMoreaux
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 372
Joined: 22 Sep 2003

PostPost by: poiuyt » Thu Dec 23, 2004 2:27 pm

I agree with your statement, but I'd rather take a chance of burning
out the coil than losing the car. I don't think the coil will ger
hot enough to burn. Most thieves will give up rather than try to
analyze the problem.

If they are going to tow the car there is nothing you can do outside
of a gialt U-lock through the wheel.

Steve B.

-- In ***@***.***, "Robert D. LaMoreaux"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> If you have a negative ground car and run a switch that puts
> ground on
> the positive side of the points, they will physically open, but
will

> be shorted to ground by the switch. Thus, electrically they
appear

> not to open and there is no spark.
>

The only problem with this is that it will mean that as long as the
ignition

is on there will be current flowing through the coil. So the coil
will get

hotter and hotter as the battery gets drained away.

Personally I have a power kill switch installed under the door
below my knee

which has a non-removable handle. I had a switch with a removable
handle and

it was so unreliable I put the Lucas one on for a reliable
connection!!!


I turn the switch off when I leave the car and I don't really
worry. Most

people either don't know what the car is or respect it enough to
not want to

take it from a good home. The ones that worry me aren't going to
drive the

car off, but would tow it away so killing the ignition wouldn't
matter. At

home the Elan sits next to a car worth a lot more and much more
likely to

get stolen. I don't worry about someone breaking into my garage to
steal the

Elan, since they'd take the new car first.

My future in-laws are the same way about their Alfa and it is much
more rare

and worth a lot more than my Elan.

These cars are in a niche where while they are classics, they
aren't the

muscle cars that the kids want to take for a joy ride, and they
aren't rare

enough and worth enough for the pro to take it. Besides the close
pedals

keep most people from being able to drive an Elan with their street
shoe and

that works too! <grin>

Rob LaMoreaux

MTS Systems Corp.
Powertrain technology Division
4622 Runway Blvd.
Ann Arbor, MI 48108
734-822-9696
Fax 734-973-1103
Main Desk 734-973-1111
www.mtspt.com
Work email: [email protected]
Home email: [email protected]
Steve B.<br>1969 Elan S4
poiuyt
Third Gear
Third Gear
 
Posts: 346
Joined: 23 Feb 2004
Previous

Total Online:

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests