Pulling the engine & transmission - Spyder Frame

[stugilmour]

I am partially prepped to pull the engine, and have a few questions. Some answers may vary a bit as I have an MT75 attached to the Twin Cam in a modern Spyder space frame.

• On the Spyder space frame set-up, do folks generally unfasten the engine mounts from the frame but leave the arms in place?
• Is the stock diff set-up with splines so the drive shaft can be pulled with the engine / transmission unit, or do I have to unfasten the output flange at the rear of the transmission? (MT75 with a flange; not sure of stock set-up)
• Can the speedometer cable generally be unfastened at the angle drive, or do I have to pull the cable from the head and pull it thru?
• Can the carbs be left in place on the Stromberg head? Looks like it should work?
• Is it best to sling under the engine, or can the slings be attached in any way?
• Will I have to remove the formed header, or can I just drop the pipe and pull the whole unit?
  

Any suggestions appreciated.

[Bud English]

Stu - Since you posted this yesterday and no replies to date, I'll help where I can.

- I have no knowledge of the spyder frame, so I can't help with that part.

- The stock diff has a bolted input flange. With your MT75 , I believe you are bolted up at both ends. The diff end will be the easiest to unbolt, but I think you'll be forced to unbolt the transmission end through the access plug under the carpet on the pass side. You'll have to take the seat out. I don't think there's a chance that you can get the motor/trans/drive shaft out intact with the body on.

- I don't know about the MT75 trans and the speedo cable.

- I think, in the past I've pulled the engine on my +2 with both the carbs and cast exhaust manifold intact.

- As for the sling question, I'll bet that, now that I've committed to helping with the above questions, some helpful expert will come along to tell you where I'm wrong and have a great way to lift the motor. I hope so because I really can't remember the best way with the body still on the frame.

Not a great help, reading back.

[stugilmour]

Big help to me Bud. Sunny day, so will take a closer look. Couldn't look yesterday as driveway was really wet from hosing away anti-freeze. Hadn't counted on the seat removal; will check it out and try disconnecting prop shaft at the transmission end. Will try pull with carbs in place, which would save a ton of tuning work I expect. Less panicked for time today as the guy with our club engine lift is out of town, which will delay my job a bit. Hoping starter motor will fit by the removed Spyder engine mounts as starter alignment is the reason for the pull.

Thanks again. Any other info / tips welcome.

[stugilmour]

As there wasn't much for replies and it's a rainy day, I thought I would post a quick summary of my engine pull effort for future reference while fresh in my head. This was my first time doing this with the body in place. For guys doing the body off thing right now, look over how you are running a bunch of this stuff to make a future engine pull easier when your resto is completed; I wasn't too bad on this but a few things will need adjustment. Pay particular attention to your brake lines (clear of the engine mount bolts), reverse light switch wires (not attached to the frame & with accessible connector), dizzy wire(s) easy to disconnect from coil and separate from any other wires, position of bonnet release cables, hoses & wires on fire wall, and electric fan temperature controller wiring (extra connector required for mine).

My car is a Federal Plus 2 with the stock Lotus TC, Ford MT75 five speed, and a Spyder space frame, so some stuff is non-stock and may differ from your car. Post any additions or corrections; pretty sure I have missed something.

Jacked up car and rested tires on four ~6 1/2" high blocks (made with dimensional lumber & screws) with screwed in place wheel chocks. These allow me to safely get under the car to disconnect stuff but are not so high that the engine crane runs out of height. I had to do this job outside as I already know my garage ceiling is too low for the required crane height. The whole assembly has to be very high to clear the nose of the car.

Removed bonnet. A bit awkward by myself. Placed protective rags under bonnet nose at hinge points to prevent paint damage. Removed right side first and left arm in place to support bonnet during removal.

Drained engine oil. Was able to leave filter in place. The MT75 transmission did not require draining, but I understand the stock Lotus transmission requires draining or the transmission oil will dump out the rear seal when the assembly is tilted for removal.

Removed front cross brace from Spyder chassis. My stock Plus 2 chassis had this feature as well, but I understand not all Elan chassis have the removable brace.

Unfastened sway bar at the top of the dog bones where they attach to the chassis. Was able to pull sway bar down low enough to prevent fouling the deep portion of the oil pan.

Removed transmission tunnel trim, shifter boot, and shift lever extension (non-stock). Fortunately I had previously modified the Spyder supplied shift lever with additional threads and a grub screw to allow removal of the lever extension; I don't think the transmission would be easily removable with a standard crane without this mod as the car would have to be very high in the air for the lever to clear the tunnel, resulting in too low a crane height.

Disconnected the following from engine/transmission assembly:

• Oil pressure sender wire.
• Temperature sender wire.
• Fuel line (plugged with suitable bolt & clamp).
• Vacuum hose on manifold.
• Remote breather line (non-stock).
• Coolant overflow line (non-stock).
• Ignition wires to dizzy (two of these on my Pertronix dizzy, plus high tension coil wire). Had to modify my home made loom a bit as the easy way to disconnect these wires is at the ring connectors at the coil, and I had included the oil pressure sender wire within the same loom jacketing material. Will modify on re-assembly.
• Fan temperature sensor wires (non-stock located in Clivey Boy thermostat housing). Need a better way of connecting / running the wiring on this part as I had to twist the wire to take the sensor out. Will correct on re-assembly.
• Fan power wires from radiator assembly (non-stock). Had installed a connector for this.
• Starter wires (non-stock). Two ring connector wires for mine with integral solenoid.
• Alternator wires (non-stock). Had easy shaped connectors and ring terminals for these wires.
• Reverse light switch wires from transmission (easy to forget). Mine is non-stock. Not sure how this is done with stock configuration; make sure you have an easily accessible remote connector under the hood for these wires.
• Speedometer cable from transmission (easy to forget). Was just able to get at this from under the car with the MT75 angle drive and Spyder frame, but may require removal of right seat and access panel removal in stock configuration?
• Choke & throttle cables at carb linkage.
• Air filter & back plate (non-stock in my case). Did not need to remove carbs. Back plate looked way too close to the paint for comfort.
• Clutch hydraulic line (non-stock) Disconnected at master cylinder and threaded through hoses to make sure it is free.
• Exhaust pipe & muffler. Disconnected at base of header and removed pipe and muffler from car.
• Prop shaft flange at transmission output. With the Spyder chassis I was able to do this from under the car by rotating the prop shaft with one rear wheel jacked up. Did not need to open up the inspection hatch on the right side of the tunnel. Spyder supplied bolts on output flange use a hex head to loosen and a six point star socket head to easily remove. The six point star will not take full torque, so used a spanner to loosen.

Took a good look around for any restrictions. I did not need to remove my brake servo's (Federal car with two servo cans), but clearance with alternator adjustment bracket (non-stock) and front servo can was very close. Special attention to bonnet opening cables, heater hoses, wires, etc. to prevent fouling. I did not need to remove my starter from the MT75, but clearance was very close. Header pipes (Bean formed exhaust manifold, non-stock) at head was left in place and no issues.

Removed radiator and associated hoses. Disconnected heater hoses and removed non-stock coolant expansion tank & hoses. Cleaned up spilled coolant mess.

Engine lift crane with tilting mechanism brought in to place. Front sling placed at shallow portion of oil pan (right where it deepens). Rear sling placed on bell housing as far back as possible while still clearing fire wall. Took the weight off the mounts. Had to jockey slings to make as short as possible to allow sufficient vertical movement with crane.

Unfastened transmission mount to free rear assembly. Removed entire bracket; MT75 will foul space frame in this location and will not drop until assembly is moved forward slightly.

Unfastened Spyder engine mount arms to free the front assembly. Removed engine mounts (the rubber deals) from the Spyder frame and disconnected any ground straps. This provides tons of additional clearance for the starter, headers, etc. Only difficulty for me was on one of the mounts I did not leave enough socket wrench clearance when running the rear brake line loop over the mount; will adjust this before re-assembly. The Spyder top arms and bolts to the engine block were left in place both sides with no issues; just needed to remove bolts attaching any ground straps.

Remove unit. I did this myself, but a second set of hands would have been welcome. Assembly needs to be at a fairly extreme angle to get out. For the Plus 2, spots to watch for binding include front of the pan in the cross member cut out, alternator bracket on the servo, tail assembly on the narrow frame, carbs, header. Be very careful for forward pendulum travel as assembly comes free at transmission tail housing; I tagged the front of the bonnet opening and put a small divot in the paint.

HTH

[Bud English]

Stu-

That will be helpful to someone in the future tackling the job for the first time.

Nice thing about your MT75 with the flanged output shaft is that you're not dribbling gear lube the moment you tip the engine/trans on end.

Nice job.

[stugilmour]

Thanks Bud. I will try a further post when it goes back in the car (week or two).

[stugilmour]

Quick update on installing the engine and transmission. My trusted mechanic has installed a Speedi-Sleeve in the crank and replaced the pan gaskets, so hopefully the result will be a leak free engine. We also installed additional baffling in the sump, properly aligned and Heli-Coiled the bell to engine and starter motor mounts for the MT75.

One tip I learned the hard way. Come up with a way to support the prop shaft flange if you will be rolling the car to a new position. The universal fouled the brake line rattling around in the tunnel. I think I can reposition the line OK and no damage, but a bit of a pain.

Suspended the engine on slings on the intake & exhaust manifolds. Much better control than the slings under the pan I used for removal. Also didn't want additional load on the pan gasket as I have had a lot of issues with leaks.

Positioning the engine and transmission was surprisingly easy even without assistance. We reduced the length of the alternator adjuster, so no fouling of the front brake booster. The hoses running across the firewall had to be removed to get the tilted engine in to position. Had to reduce the tilt to about 15 degrees or so to get the MT75 tail housing 'inserted' into the Spyder space frame and keep from fouling the installed starter motor.

Once the transmission mount was roughly positioned I was able to start the large bolt thru the mount into the tail housing. Minor prying to get the four small bolts into the transmission mount.

That's as far as I got this evening. Left the unit supported on a jack stand at the bell housing. Might have made a mistake by not connecting the speedo cable prior to raising the transmission into position as it looks tight to get in there.

[stugilmour]

Finished up the job this weekend and road tested the car. Everything went back together pretty much as expected. Just a few tips to finish off...

• Getting the speedo cable back on the angle drive from below was difficult, but I eventually got it. I found a spanner helpful for guiding the coupling on to the fine threads.
• Take pictures of where everything is located, including wire routing, hoses, etc. I had to remove some of the clips for this stuff and had minor difficulties remembering what went on top or through stuff.
• Bleed the MT75 internal clutch slave cylinder prior to mounting the exhaust as access is way easier.
• Mark or bag the motor mounts as left & right. I had relieved the bolt holes slightly to get clearance for the carbs, and I was unsure which one went on which side.
• Added Riv-Nuts to the firewall hose clamps so they are much easier to access now with a stubby screw driver.
• Only job I needed help with was putting the bonnet back on; what a PITA that set-up is!